Ep 231 Sujala Shastry | A Cross-Cultural Story of Childhood Loss, Growth, and Finding Your Voice

 

SHOW NOTES SUMMARY: 

In this soul-stirring episode, we explore the profound journey of Sujala Shastry, who lost her mother to a brain tumor at age 11 in India.

Her story illuminates the complex intersection of cultural silence, emotional isolation, and the transformative power of breaking generational patterns around grief.

Key Takeaways:

  • The impact of losing a mother in a joint family system that provided physical but not emotional support.
  • How 20 years of survival mode led to disconnection, anxiety, and lost memories.
  • The awakening that came with motherhood and the desire to heal generational trauma.
  • The cultural dynamics of grief in Indian versus Western society.
  • Finding one’s voice and creating boundaries after decades of people-pleasing.
  • The launch of her podcast “Discovering Journeys” as a platform for authentic connection.

Sujala shares how one can be profoundly lonely even when surrounded by loving family, the importance of emotionally safe spaces in healing childhood loss, and how unprocessed grief affects identity formation and relationships. This episode will inspire the importance of taking steps toward healing sooner rather than later, not as a means to rush, emotionally bypass, or forget. Instead, one must immerse oneself in one’s inner emotional world to truly feel the hurt and pain so that it can be transmuted to live as full of a life as possible.

RESOURCES:


CONNECT WITH SUJALA:

Finding Strength in Grief – Sujala Shastry’s Journey to Healing

Blog Post: Finding Strength in Grief – Sujala Shastry’s Journey to Healing

In a recent episode of Grieving Voices, Sujala Shastry shared her profound journey through grief, healing, and self-discovery. A native of Bangalore, India, now living in France, Sujala’s story began with the unexpected loss of her mother to a brain tumor when she was just eleven years old. That loss, compounded by the absence of emotional support, shaped her early years and set her on a decades-long path of survival, self-reflection, and eventual transformation.

A Childhood Interrupted by Loss

For Sujala, the loss of her mother at such a young age was an earthquake that shifted the foundation of her life. Left to navigate her emotions alone, she felt numb, dissociated, and isolated. The absence of a safe emotional space to process her feelings meant she carried unresolved grief into adulthood, often feeling like an outsider among her peers.

“I needed someone to tell me it was okay to feel sadness, pain, and everything in between,” Sujala said. But without that reassurance, she spent 20 years in survival mode, grappling with anger, sensitivity, and a pervasive sense of being unmoored.

A Turning Point Abroad

Moving to France in her 30s marked the beginning of a significant shift. Away from the distractions of her old life, she found herself with the space to pause and reflect. It was here that she began the arduous process of sitting with her emotions—acknowledging the pain she had buried for so long.

“I had to face the reality of my loss and allow myself to grieve fully,” Sujala explained. This meant confronting the bittersweet truth of not knowing her mother well and mourning the lost memories stolen by time and survival.

The Healing Process

Sujala’s healing journey was not linear, nor was it easy. It was an “onion-like” process, peeling back layers of grief, anger, and loneliness. Along the way, she immersed herself in books, grief communities, and countless resources to understand the effects of unresolved grief on her mental and emotional well-being.

For Sujala, finding others who shared similar experiences was transformative. “For the first time, I realized I wasn’t alone or ‘mad’ for feeling the way I did,” she shared. These connections, combined with a newfound understanding of her emotions and the boundaries she needed to set, became the pillars of her recovery.

The New Sujala

Emerging from her grief, Sujala has transformed into a version of herself she is proud to love. She describes this new chapter as one where she is more confident, self-assured, and unapologetic about protecting her peace.

“The Sujala of today doesn’t tolerate nonsense, sets boundaries, and surrounds herself with meaningful relationships. People who knew me years ago wouldn’t recognize me now—and that’s a good thing.”

Lessons from Sujala’s Journey

Sujala’s story highlights the importance of emotional support, self-reflection, and community in navigating grief. Her journey reminds us that healing often requires sitting with discomfort and facing emotions head-on, even when it feels unbearable.

Her words offer hope to others navigating similar paths:
“You have to go through the tunnel of hardship, but when you come out on the other side, you find a version of yourself you never knew existed.”

Final Thoughts

Grief is a deeply personal journey, but as Sujala’s story shows, it is also a path to rediscovery and growth. By sharing her experience, she provides a beacon of hope for others navigating the complexities of loss.

For anyone struggling to find their way through grief, Sujala’s journey is a testament that healing is possible, and on the other side lies a stronger, more authentic you.

Episode Transcription:

Victoria Volk: Hello, and welcome to another episode of Grieving Voices. Today, my guest is Sujala Shastry. And she is here today to share a story of loss of her mother when she was a child and just recently launched her own podcast called Discovering Journeys. And Thank you so much for being here today. I know it’s been a while since you have applied and I’m excited to have you as a guest and for you to share your story. And so what before we get into that, I just want people to get a little sense of who you are, where you’re from, what do you do, all of that. So welcome.

Sujala Shastry: Thank you. Yeah. Thank you, Victoria, for having me on grieving voices. I am Sujala. I’m basically from south of India called the place called Bangla. And I and I’ve been living in France for close to a decade now. So yeah. I have been a engineer before. Then I moved in here as an expat, leading my life, starting a family and Oh. The life goes. Then then I did my masters because I just wanted to come back to again, go back to carrier and everything. But that didn’t pan out very well. So got a job. I lost a job. Then I was like, okay. This is something was not something was not right. So and the idea of podcasting came and after a year of learning things, again, learning things reinventing myself because I know that my voice is going to be out out in the world. So I was very uncomfortable even though I loved the idea of podcast. So it took a while for me to be Okay. Be comfortable with it and to come. So so very happy that I launched my podcast and happy to be on the other side of the as a guest as well. So that’s been my recent one. And the point of if I have to share my start sharing my story, I lost my mom when I was eleven years old. And it it was not something which anybody expects. It just happens. And she was ill. And I lost her to brain tumor. It was really hard time because I didn’t know how to navigate. I think I think my grief journey started with that not knowing what to do. So my initial feelings were just numb. And a dissociation. Maybe maybe I was struggling with accepting the fact that she was no longer there. So yeah. I think I think those were the very initial things. And Unfortunately, it stayed for a very long time with me because I did not understand I was grieving. I was just I just thought I was not coping well. But now and adult me understand how young I was when I was eleven years old. But I did not understand that time, and I think I understand her very well. Why she couldn’t understand she was in a date of shock and so what happens in a grief when you lose a parent or somebody who is so close to you at such an engage is You don’t know how to navigate this one path. Second thing is you don’t understand what’s happening around you. Within you, around you who in life, everything freezes for a while. And for me, without having I had a lot of people around me. They were all great providers. They took care of me. But, emotionally, there was nobody to held my hand and Help me and tell me that it is okay. It is okay to whatever you’re feeling, sadness, pain, heavy, you can name because many grief grief, you can’t define by one statement because everyone experiences, you know, completely separate ways. So I just wanted, I think, somebody to tell me that it’s okay. Whatever you’re feeling, it will go through. And I think I needed that emotional save space. So that is something I struggled with. And, unfortunately, it went for too long for for two decades, I was in a survival mode of not understanding what’s happening to me. Why why am I angry? Why am I so sensitive? Why I am so lost? I couldn’t connect with my friends. I couldn’t connect with their, you know, the lightings because you I was just before the teenager, I lost my mom. So when you shift to a teenager, you try to know about yourself, I never had Ziel for anything. So yeah. That took a very long time. And finally, after moving to France, I think I got time to be with myself and started to heal, wanted to be a bitter mother for my son. And I I think that’s where I started and Then I then I started to understand lot of things about myself. And yeah. Here we are. So just to put it in a nutshell, this was been my this has been my grieving journey so far.

Victoria Volk: What do you think was the turning point? Or was there something specific that helped you turn that page?

Sujala Shastry: I think something was bothering me. It was bothering me something was not okay. Santa, because I couldn’t I felt I was very different from all of my friends, all of the society and everything. So a typical thirty year old or a twenty year old, I never matched that. So people were interested in, you know, ambition, which party to wear, which clothes to wear. You know, the sort of normal things, and seventeen, eighteen year old, or a twenty year old does. But I was never interested in that. So I think I had I had started noticing it because I’m a very sensitive person and I observe and I care a lot for people. So I started to notice it was there. In my back of my mind, I think it was there. But as I had developed high functioning anxiety, I suppressed it. So I was always in the school mode exam exam, then engineering work, that is push, you know, I deviated myself for a very long period of time because it was comfortable. Because I didn’t know that I have I had to look inward, but that that’s something inside was totally so so messed up. And I think coming to France gave me that space. I think at that point, I think I was also, like, around thirty. So it told me that, okay. You know, you’re very sensitive. You understand everybody. I think it’s time to understand yourself a bit. So I didn’t know that it would be next few years would be so painful for me to start the healing process, but yeah. That was a turning point. The pause helped me. Because I did not have anywhere to escape, you see.

Victoria Volk: So what was what was that like? Because you just described, like, you were, like, walking to this into this abyss of healing and you didn’t know how painful it would be. What were the resources or the tools? Or what were you doing during that time to support yourself in your healing?

Sujala Shastry: I think Vesta had to go through the uncomfortable hang of sitting with the emotion. I think that was the most painful part. Because I allowed myself for the first time in my life to, like, you know, hundred percent feel. What I missed about my mother that I that my mother was dead, I had to tell it out loud. Even though it looks very simple to many of them, but to the grievers understand that when you say it out loud, it hits you Mhmm. Every single time. And I had to deal with that emotion and this took time. And I also had to come face to face with the fact that I didn’t know my mother well. I think that hurt me the most while in the initial time because eleven years you’re a kid. You just know very, very basic things.
And because of being in survival mode for twenty years, I have lost memory of her for so many things. There was dissociation, and I have deep sense of loneliness, and a brain fog as well. So and panic attacks at times. So I think I had to it was like an onion, like a big big onion. And I had to open. And the thing was I didn’t know that how many layers were there. Now I can say, fast forward to know I can laugh about it and everything, but Yeah. That thing, I think, that shook me quite a bit. That shook me quite a bit.

Victoria Volk: Reflecting back, do you feel like a lot of those emotions were coming back up when you became a parent?

Sujala Shastry: Oh, definitely. Definitely. Definitely. That is like I know the name of the head. There is no escape. There is absolutely no escape.

Victoria Volk: That was my experience too because I lost my father when I was eight and my mother was emotionally unavailable. And so just similar experience just flipped different roles. But, yeah, it wasn’t having kids. Like, they bring up every single insecurity that you have about yourself and all of your shadows and everything about you that you struggle with. Right? It they they challenge just the core of of who you think you are. Yes. I’m curious because, like, for me, my journey was a lot of my personal development really started was when my youngest started kindergarten. I had so much of my identity wrapped up in my kids. Right?
And that’s when it really started for me. So self health books became huge in my life at that time. Personal development programs, I was taking every personality quiz known to man just to help myself understand myself, figure myself out, fix myself, get my shit together, and and that went on for a good five years. Until I discovered grief recovery, which completely changed my life. So is there anything in specifically for you that changed your life? A program, a person, certain therapy? What was it? Do you think?

Sujala Shastry: I think books books helps a lot. That helped me a lot. And on the Internet, learn learning about joining a grief community. For a very brief period, I joined a community where griefers can just tell how they feel. And for the first time, I felt, oh, I was not really mad. I didn’t have to be mad about myself or feeling something so normal normal in this line. You know? So I was like, okay. Not bad. Okay. I am in okay. This is my community. And even though we don’t know each other, but the sense of loss that gave me comfort, books made me understand. And and learning about, you know, why I became like this and how it is connected to my grief. And because I wasn’t able to navigate it well, I was I I did lot of, you know, developed a lot of consequences part of it. So this helped me in understanding me, and I think That told me that, okay. Now I need to help. Now I have understood myself. I’ve sat with it. Okay. Yes. It’s not good, but I cannot let another twenty years go by. So I think all of these things helped and and also many grieving interviews like this. Help me. So sometimes it used to be overloaded for me as well because I’m on I’m on m path. So I absorb very easily. So so for me, tap to be breaks, So it has to be in at my own timeline, I had to take space, breathe, understand. So some it was, like, it was gradual for sure, but it was all the pounds were moving together. So if it was one month, was understanding a concept of brain fog. I didn’t know what was brain fog, but I had the symptom myself. So that took me understand. And then it just helped me that others also faced it. So that gave me comfort and that gave me some better strength that, you know, I have I, you know, this was a thing. When you don’t have anybody to navigate, you think you’re not strong enough or you’re not you’re not coping well, you’re not good enough. But I did more than my capacity, and I’m so proud of that little girl of mine now, but unfortunately, that time I wasn’t. So I think that this understanding with various groups and moving gradually everything, then I said, okay. Okay. This is my whole mess. This is my understanding. And what can I do? So that is when I started the this one. So everything helped. I think everything helped. There is nothing. One thing which didn’t help me because I took you know, it’s like surviving again. It is like surviving to understand and surviving to come on the other side. So I took every material, like, possibly I can book, paper, interviews, stories, journeys, lectures, YouTube, and tech talks on grief have done everything. There’s nothing I have left page unturned. It’s just that I didn’t come out and speak to people. That’s probably I didn’t do it. Because I never felt emotionally safe to do that because I felt around me people didn’t understand what I was going through, and that happens. So apart from that, I did everything.

Victoria Volk: You had touched on being an empath and I’m too. And so I imagine as a young child, like for me, I needed a lot of sleep. Like, I slept a lot. Was that your experience too?

Sujala Shastry: Nice to cry myself to sleep. Damn.

Victoria Volk: I would hide to cry. I would fall in the under my bed and fall asleep crying because we’re in the linen closet. The kitchen covered. Like, I would hide to cry.

Sujala Shastry: Yeah. I lived in a joint family, so I think the only time I could cry my heart out while I was crying. I mean, while I was before I go to sleep, So that’s one time I cried. I think I’ve cried. I don’t know. It’s almost every day I can say. Maybe maybe the timings of my cry would vary. But, yes, every day it was. Yeah, being an empath is not easy and losing a parent is not easy. And they’re not having emotional support is also not easy. So it is, like, we are already your personality, your situation doesn’t, you know, give you a give you a strong foundation to navigate.

Victoria Volk: What have you learned about energy? Like your personal energy, energy work, energy healing? Has that been a component of your healing as an empath? No.

Sujala Shastry: Oh. I have just learned that I didn’t have a boundary as an impact. And now I have the boundary maybe speak the same language, but in a different terminology maybe. But yes. This has has been my discipline. So I understood why this whole emotional trauma led to people who are like, why I’ve why was it tolerating them? Why was I tolerating their posiness? Why was I tolerating their snappy attitude? You know? But you do. I did. I clearly did. And I am angry at myself that that’s that that my friends group and everything was was not so we haven’t there for me emotionally as well because that is how you attract.

Victoria Volk: Well, and you’re very selfish as a as a young person. Right? Like, you’re just gonna be selfish. It’s all it is all about you. Right? But I think too, when it comes to being an empath. It’s when you were speaking to the idea of tolerating how people are treating you. I think it’s – I think as an empath, we internalize. Well, that What does that say about me? I did something. And we we almost own the response of other people

Sujala Shastry: Yes.

Victoria Volk: Because we immediately think it must be something about us.

Sujala Shastry: Mhmm. We accommodate them, give give our own reason. For me, at this point, I’m like, what was I thinking? But well, that was a part of me, which is no longer there. So

Victoria Volk: which brings a great segue into the Sajala before. Sajala now, what are the key differences do do you feel about you? If people who know you knew you then like, I’m and I imagine that you’ve had a lot of people fall away in your life. Just Oh, yeah. This is brown.

Sujala Shastry: They just automatically just dropped like, a pack of cuts, you go forward and they just drop. So the before Sujala was tolerating, bossiness, snappiness, and, you know, crankiness of others. Was a people pleaser? Was was always available for others? Always. Whether they have been there for me or not, but I will still be there for them. They can just decision I will I’ll be there and they then people could walk over me with their decisions, with their attitude, or they could just use me as a punching bag. You know, and somebody who was so low like, have no confidence, no self esteem. All of this was me. All of this was me. And now, Sujala, I think I have fallen in love with her for the first time in my life. I can’t remember previously as a baby I had loved myself or not because with the brain forgets that itself, that’s also gone. That memory is gone of me. That I think I fall in love with with this version of myself who do not tolerate nonsense, who who is very caring, who is very understanding, but with boundaries. And I can recognize far off that you’re being, you know, all those attitude, the which doesn’t come. You’re just pushed away. So that one and I am confidence wise, I am getting there. I’m getting there. I’m getting there. I’m getting there. But how how much I have come? I’m happy, Pete? No. Yes. And then I now I have meaningful people in my So people who come into my life match my energy and people who don’t who are not in my life. Either they know the old version of Sakella, and not the new version. And another interesting fact is they cannot the new version of Sadhana. They’re like, what? What happened? To her. I’m like, I am no longer the old version. So this is new me, happy me, peaceful me. So, you know, speak or small mindedness is no There’s no space around me for that. If that the gate is closed and you can’t say whatever you want to my face and I’ll be quiet. I’m no longer that girl. So yeah. It’s been quite a journey, but I’m really be proud of myself. And I feel so happy to say to anybody, you know. Because you asked I feel so happy you asked this question because not many understand that it’s like you have really you know, you have to really go through that that whatever. That tunnel of, you know, hardship, that uncomfortableness, that burning sensation, the sleepless nights, the anger and the and the huge amount of crime. So and you come outside of the another tunnel and you find yourself the new you. Is just amazing. So yeah. Anybody who haven’t spoken to me in the last, I don’t know, seven, eight years. If they haven’t connected to me face to face apart from just a bit wish is not considered I don’t consider wishes as connection. It’s just a wish. But if you haven’t connected me as a person, you don’t know me. I sometimes I look I can’t recognize myself.

Victoria Volk: Imagine if we all just went through, like, our Facebook friend list and just eliminated all the people that really don’t know us. How many how many people would we actually have on our friend’s list or

Sujala Shastry: a friend’s head? One hand, two hands lucky. One hand, I think I think it was okay. Yeah. That’s what I did. I I think it was five or five years back. I just deleted myself from all the WhatsApp groups. School engineering, some office groups. Everything everything I was out. Apart from the family one, I have two or three, the family groups apart from that, none of the groups I’m associated with.
I just deleted myself. And guess what? Nobody bothered. May one or two of them asked, oh, what is it? You’ve logged in. I said, I I just didn’t feel good being part of the group, so I removed myself. And that’s it. No more questions asked. Nothing else. And I’m happy with it. I don’t expect them to understand it as well. So Yeah. It is very surprising that out of all the groups you, like, delete yourself from. They were only I can even count. There are only three people who contacted me. There are so many that what happened. And that when I gave this answer, they all they said they they just said, okay. And just left it at that. So yeah. Because sometimes people don’t want to know more about you. That’s what I realized. They’re not as interesting that I as I was there for them, they don’t want to ask me how I am, what is it, and everything. And and the surprising factors in the initial part oh, this is one thing I didn’t mention during this what helped me to change was blogging as well. So I opened one blog web side called Medley Tales and I just started to write letters to my mother. This one and this helped me and I published it on the WhatsApp group, on Instagram, on Facebook, but apart from because for many people, it was a new it was a news. Not many of my friends knew that I had lost my mom. Yeah. So I was in school, like, till the grade ten. In one school, everybody knew because it happened during that time. So anybody who was known after the age of fifteen, I ordered only one or two, three people. That’s it. Not many of them new. And now I wonder why. And then I know, first of all, I wasn’t comfortable. Second, People never gave me that emotional safe space for me to share it with them. And to the ones I shared, were taken aback, were so uncomfortable, and they don’t want to talk. So many of my friends who even though they know the they know that I have lost my mom, they don’t even know why I know how I lost my mom. They don’t ask that question. They’re so uncomfortable. Do you

Victoria Volk: think this brings up a great point? And I actually have a note for myself. Is Do you think that’s and granted, I know in Western society that’s very true, but in Indian culture? Is that, like, what were the beliefs about grief and death and dying that you learned in your culture? And how is that how do you What do you recognize are the differences now being in France and and knowing what you know now, like, what are the cultural things that you have connected the dots with growing up and what you were taught and learned and and

Sujala Shastry: No. That’s a great question. I never thought about that, but I will try answering it. Back there, there’s a support system in India. So since we are all, like, you know, joint family and close knit it, We have a lot of people. They take care of your food, your is your dress ready, or going to school, everything is taken care of, but emotions are not discussed. It’s it’s wrapped. Another carpet shoved it far away because people I think people don’t know how to support a griever. They they know how to be insensitive. They know how to make very easy. I don’t know. Rough. Rough for a rude comment, but they don’t know how to be good. And and during the course of the last five, six years, I have spoken to a lot of people interactions, sometime one off, you know, just for fifteen, twenty minutes, just sharing. What I have felt is I think whole world were just not comfortable to speak about the dead person, especially to the person who are very close to them. It’s closed. I think this has been a very uniform aspect to what to my understanding is. And in India, what I felt was you have a good support system in this in terms of providing taking care of, you don’t have to cook meals. There are people who will do that stuff for you. That is a good part of that, but the emotional part. I think it was I I I don’t say it’s low. It was zero. Let us you know, let’s be honest, it was zero. They will not talk about they nobody spoke about my mother in front of me. Nobody. Oh, we will make her sad. Oh, we will make her. But that’s the whole point. They got it wrong. I felt that only I was keeping my mother and everybody else were moving on. But that’s not true. They were grieving in a different way, but it affected me more because it’s my mother. But not speaking about your person, doesn’t reduce anything, but rather it increases. It increases the heaviness what I had to hold on to for so many years. It was not needed. Yes. We lost a person. All of us did. They were his my mom had both of their parents. My dad I, brothers, such a closed neck, big family, but we all love somebody we love. And I don’t know why we couldn’t speak. And I think that really breaks my heart. It really breaks my heart to say that why you why it’s not that others were in grieving. It’s not that my grandfather was not grieving. She was the only daughter. Among the boys. So she was scared. She was she was loved. But why you couldn’t share it with her own daughter? There is nobody tell me that, oh, your mom used to do this. Yes. I would miss her, but I would also feel I would have felt good that, oh, okay. She was like that. I’m You’re learn you’d be learning about her. Yeah. Exactly. And I suppressed my emotions so much that all the bad and the good memories. Everything is in a box that sometimes, like, out of the bloom, I just get it top. And I’m like, what? From where was this memory from? So I’m still in that process. I don’t have a lot of memory, but it keeps coming up in the most unexpected day all the time. I think that is the most uncomfortable thing because sometimes you’re outside and sometimes my son say something and something just strikes back. I’m like oh, I’m like, okay. That night, I’m like, okay. What was that memory? What was that memory? I’m now I’m curious because now I’m not in a separation mode. Does the opposite. So I’m trying to dig deep and sometimes it is half memory and it hurts me. It hurts me to the cover that I don’t have a complete memory of that at least particular situation. Yeah. Yeah. I I think we deviate I think I deviated what was the question?

Victoria Volk: No. You answered it and actually Okay. You have a lot of pictures.

Sujala Shastry: Yeah. Some. For those for that time, yes. It’s quite a few. No.
It is not now that you can have twenty.

Victoria Volk: No. No. Exactly.

Sujala Shastry: But yeah. I do have I do have the memories I traveled with her. I do have memories of playing board games with her. Yeah. Yeah. I do. Yeah. Slowly. This yeah. It’s there, but I’m happy. It’s there.

Victoria Volk: You mentioned Well, and I was just gonna say too, the art for my podcast is me on an island holding a megaphone. Right? And I think that’s when you were speaking, that’s what I envisioned as, like, as a family. Right? You’re each putting yourselves on these griving islands. But if only you would just talk about it, you could come together on the island and Oh. It’d be your own community. And so has that started to shift and change as you’ve been talking more and going through your process or no?

Sujala Shastry: No. No. Because not everybody is still the is still uncomfortable. They read my blog they get emotional. They say you’ve written it very well, expressed it well. That’s it. So I think it’s difficult for them as well, and I think it’s I think it’s a generation. Right? It’s the whole generation. Just didn’t know what to do with the emotions. And I am glad that we are there is a wave of change in terms of emotions. In the last five, six years. So somehow it coincided with my healing journey and my age as well. But yeah. I think it’s it’s sad, but I feel I think if after hearing on the podcast, maybe if somebody picks up the call and shares some memories about my mom, I think I will I will let you know. I think it is a win. It’s a start. But sleep chances. I don’t have any expectations.

Victoria Volk: But I think the most important thing too is I know the impact my healing has had on my parenting, which in turn has an impact on my my the journey my children will take emotionally. Yes. And that’s why I always say the greatest gift we can give our kids is our own feeling and why it’s so important for us to dust and sweep our own doorstep first before thinking our kids are the problem, our kids have behavioral issues, our kids are have emotional issues, what have you look in the mirror And what is it that you are not looking at that is being projected onto your kids? Or what are they emulating and learning from you? Because we

Sujala Shastry: learned yeah.

Victoria Volk: We learned by the age of three, seventy five percent of how to respond to life. The rest comes by age fifteen, those formative teen years. So and it’s not to say, once they hit fifteen or three or four or five, it’s too late. Mhmm. It’s not it’s not too late. You know, it took me thirty years, three decades to figure my shit out. But, you know, how many times I’ve said to myself, man, I wish I would have discovered grief recovery sooner. I wish I would have, you know, that’s grief too. That’s grief too. Always. And you did touch on job loss. And I don’t want to gloss over that because that’s that’s a loss too. Nobody has to die for us to grieve. Right? And so that was a catapult for you to lean into your creative urge to do your podcast, but I’m sure at the time it was painful.
Yeah? Yes.

Sujala Shastry: You bought a very beautiful thing. They always think I grieve about my mom, but I have so many other points to grieve. I would really like to tell that. I had you I also have to grief about the girl I would be if my mom would be alive. Yep?

Victoria Volk: Yep. What what could have been?

Sujala Shastry: Yeah. What could have been. I agree for that girl. Who could have been and I just changed the trajectory of it because of one death and that’s my closest person. And second one is for all the last years of me being in the survival mode. That’s a grief too. Mhmm. I still grieve it, and it angers me. So, yeah, it’s like twenty years I was alive. Okay? But I lost those many years in coping. Copying the unknown. I don’t I didn’t even I was coping something, but I didn’t even know I was coping. I didn’t understand. So I have to so People talk about always the grief. Your mom won’t be there on your wedding day or when your kid is born. That is a given. But what people don’t understand is all the in between days, you grief, there was this one instant where I think it choked me so much. My son was two years old. He had a very bad year infection. My husband was done with vital flu. I had to take care of everything in the house. At that point, You know, I I still remember. I just screamed in the night saying that why you had to die and make me struggle so much because mentally, physically, it was exhausting for me. Do all the work, keep up everything, and no way to look. And I know one person whom I could have backed on blindly was my mother. And I haven’t had her for twenty eight years. So I have to grieve for that as well, not for the glossy part of, oh, he she will miss my, you know, my son’s birthday. Birth birthdays, you know, parties and everything. That’s a given. That’s a given. Everybody knows that. But they don’t know that that feeling what you have. It’s every day in different ways. And it hits you like like just like a sudden slap pat and you’re like, what? Oh my god. You grieve again that night. So it’s like it is so much and this also makes me feel I have never heard my mom on the phone because I lost her in nineteen ninety seven. The mobile phones were not in our hands yet. And it was only landline. And I and I stayed pretty much with my mom’s who never had a chance to. I was not college or anything. So I’ve never heard my mom’s voice over a phone. I don’t have a call that says, I’m a calling. I don’t have it. I have never experienced that to this one. So I grief. I can’t take a selfie with her. You grieve. So there are so many different ways you grieve. And it’s sometimes the pain brings you to numbness. You stop thinking, you stop missing, you stop feeling, and sometimes your body and your mind can’t take it. Just can’t take it. It goes to that blank state. And I just let like, it’s like a big wave has hit me and I have to just stand there Allow the big wave to pass however long that is because sometimes it’s just that. I think that this part, people who have increased, don’t understand.

Victoria Volk: Or allow themselves to grieve. Yeah. What gives you hope

Sujala Shastry: for your future? It’s just that I allow my son and people around me to be themselves. And in one of my therapy session, I was called the black sheep of the family. Because nobody speaks emotionally in my family, like the way I do. So in at my therapy at one point, I so he asked me, this this this this he’s like, you know what you’re called? I said, I don’t know. You know, the flagship of the family. I’m like, what that was the first time I got even introduced to that word and he explained to me what it is and I was like, oh, okay. So I think I would I’m happy that I had to bear all these things, but I’m happy that I can be an example if not for many at least for my son. And to be who he wants to be, how he wants to be, and I am his emotional safe space no matter what. And I give this to all my closest people, who are my people. And I feel this is my like, personally how I can change. This gives me hope that I am the change in my situation. Secondly is I started this podcast. I lost the job, and I wasn’t ready to relocate because for me family comes first. So I got lot of opportunities to move to Netherlands. Germany, but I can’t I can’t travel back and forth. So I said no to many of the offers and because family comes first to me no matter what. So I already had this idea of starting a podcast, but I thought after working for a while I’ll start, but then I think God redirected me to earlier. So I started it. So the the whole concept of podcast is also to just to listen to other people’s journey. That’s it. Because if nothing, I can be in this world. I just I just want to be I just want for that one hour, the other person feels that somebody listened to me. I think that is all I would like to give it to that person. And in a way, if it reflects to the huge audience, so let it be. I think somewhere we have lost the capability to listen to other people, emotions just because it gives us makes us feel uncomfortable. So that is my little part of and I want to build a community over it, and I have I I can’t even say I have begun. It’s just that I have made up of mind, I’ve just opened the door. So let’s see where it goes.
So These are the things. And thirdly, when I see other people, there are so many podcasts like yourself and like so many people who are there to listen. Like, it’s very warming to me that you asked there was this old versus new nobody had asked me that question. So thank you for that. So it just feels that somewhere as a community we are going, somewhere. Maybe it’s a small, but I always believe a change will be small. It it it takes it takes years to see the see what it what wave can it bring about. So, yeah, that gives me hope. So these are the three different areas I feel it’ll hopefully.

Victoria Volk: And what would you say your grief has taught you?

Sujala Shastry: That it’s so lonely,

Victoria Volk: but it doesn’t have to be.

Sujala Shastry: Yeah. But it was. So whenever whenever whenever somebody says grief, I don’t I think it’s a scar. It’s a trauma. I still carry. So I still feel lonely about it. That is how I feel, but what it has made me learn is you can also cherish people who are dead. In a vein, and you

Victoria Volk: can build your own community.

Sujala Shastry: You can build the community that you need. Yes. So it doesn’t have to be doom and gloom. Grieve. You can’t cherish it. You can share ish a person personality or something they loved or something you share something. You can share ish. That’s what the healing part of the grief has taught me that Yes. It is painful. Nobody says it is easy. It’s not that all but once you cross that path of accepting and feeling the pain, you can cherish the person.

Victoria Volk: What is one of your cherished memories of your mother? Mhmm.

Sujala Shastry: One of my cherished. I think never left me alone. She was always present with me. Like, whether I was doing my schoolwork or playing with her board games, she was always present with me when she was around me. As I said, was in a joint family. I was I lived along with eleven other people in the house. So so which of a little bit time I got with her after school and over the weekends, she used to be completely present with me. And I think this is something I I think I’ll feel her, you know. So that her presence makes me feel so when this I think why now I understand why it was so so painful for me because her presence were so comforting and wow. So yeah. I think playing board games with her was the most I think all the board games, the classic board games I learned from her. And we used to always go for haircuts together. She used to get hers. She used to get mine regularly. Second and third one was I think we used to I used to go with her for everything. Even she has to buy a small thing in the next door, I used to run with her all the time. So I think these are the few moments, I think, which comes to my mind currently. Oh, at the time?

Victoria Volk: I think one of the lessons that you’ve shared without sharing it as a lesson is that you can be completely surrounded by many people who love you and yet still feel completely alone. Yes. And that the one key differentiator that we have to those we are in relationship with is emotional connection. Yes. And had you maybe felt that your grief journey would have maybe taken a different path?

Sujala Shastry: Yes. Definitely. I wouldn’t be stuck in a survival mode for sure. At at least that would have changed. What

Victoria Volk: is all your family still in India?

Sujala Shastry: Yes.

Victoria Volk: Do you see them often? Or

Sujala Shastry: Yearly? I go yearly. Yeah. I break them.

Victoria Volk: You you mentioned you have broke. No.

Sujala Shastry: No. I’m the only kid. I have cousins.

Victoria Volk: Only child.

Sujala Shastry: Okay. Yeah. I’m the only child.

Victoria Volk: See. And that’s another aspect too. It’s, like, one thing I’ve learned in doing my podcast and and just the importance of siblings is that they kind of fill the gaps of your childhood for you, especially if you have an older sibling. And I never really looked at my siblings in that way, but it is. It’s a relationship that is so unique. They’re the people that know you in a way that nobody else does. What is one tip that you would give a hurting heart today?

Sujala Shastry: If somebody gives you the emotional space, don’t be reluctant or or to take it. Please do. Please do take it. You can pay it forward, but please do take it. If somebody is giving. And secondly, if there is nobody, try to be self aware of what you’re feeling and try to find books or online help something which you can do with your own capability. Don’t don’t prolong. It does no good to you. Forget about others. It just doesn’t do good to you.

Victoria Volk: That’s very good advice. Is there anything else you would like to share that you don’t feel you got to?

Sujala Shastry: No. I think I’ve shared so many bits of it. You you have answered I mean, you’ve questioned me so beautifully that I have shared few of the things which I haven’t shared so far with, I don’t know, with many of them. Maybe my husband, I have shared, but not not to anybody else.

Victoria Volk: I feel honored. Thank you so much.

Sujala Shastry: Thank you. Thank you so much.

Victoria Volk: On my podcast, your story. And I feel like even through cultural differences grief is the one thing that unites us all. It doesn’t matter Yes. It doesn’t discriminate and we all grow up learning these unhelpful and almost hurtful ways to cope and and and how to grieve. We do it very poorly. And that’s why my program is called do grief differently. It’s time we do grief differently. And so thank you so much for sharing your insights and what you’ve learned on your path, and for starting your podcast because the more voices that get on the mission that is similar to mine, which is changing the conversation wrong grief, talking about it, like we talk about the weather, the more that do that. The better off our next generations will be.

Sujala Shastry: Yeah. And thank you so much for I never thought I would share so many things that you were so warm and your questions made me think and Doug’s memories out of me. So thanks to you, and thank you for, you know, I really enjoyed speaking with you. And as you say, I strongly believe the how we support the grieber and how we speak about grief needs to change, and there is no doubt about it. And and I’m happy that somewhere you and me are trying to bring about a change in our own little ways. So thank you for giving me this space.

Victoria Volk: You’re welcome. Where can people find you if they wanna connect with you? Unless it’s your podcast.

Sujala Shastry: Yeah. I’m on although I’m on it is called Discovering Journeys. And you can find it on YouTube, on Spotify, on Apple, on Amazon, and then you can connect with me on Instagram, on FB, on LinkedIn. I’m there on pretty much everything. And I will I will give you the I’ll share the links with you.

Victoria Volk: Yes. And I’ll put those in the show notes. So thank

Sujala Shastry: Thank you very much. Thank you.

Victoria Volk: Have a blessed rest of 2024 as we record this. It will be published in 2025. So happy early New Year to you and holidays. I wish you a great end of 2024. And and remember, when you unleash your heart, you unleash your life, much love.

Ep 230 Kenisha Brown-Alexander | An Orphaned Adult with Hope For a Brighter Tomorrow

 

SHOW NOTES SUMMARY: 

Kenisha Nichelle is a trailblazer in the sports industry and a passionate advocate for individuals navigating the challenging landscape of grief.

Kenisha shares her deeply personal journey of overcoming profound losses, including becoming an orphaned only child with the unexpected deaths of both her father and mother, and how she has channeled her experiences into a mission of healing and empowerment.

Key Takeaways:

  • Journey of a Child Griever: Kenisha discusses the unique challenges she faced as a child griever, losing her father at the age of 12. She shares how this early loss shaped her perspective and understanding of grief and how that first loss prepared her for the loss of her mother while she was in college.
  • Turning Pain into Purpose: Learn how Kenisha transformed her grief into a purposeful mission by founding the Brighter Tomorrow Foundation Incorporated. This organization provides innovative resources for those dealing with grief, helping them find hope and healing.
  • The Role of Color Therapy: Discover how Kenisha integrates color therapy into her work, offering a unique approach to healing that supports emotional well-being and resilience.
  • Empowering Others Through Authenticity:  Kenisha emphasizes sharing her full story with vulnerability and authenticity, inspiring others to embrace their grief journey.
  • Creating Safe Spaces: Through initiatives like Game Changers United, Kenisha is dedicated to creating supportive environments where individuals, especially athletes, can navigate life’s challenges and find a sense of belonging.

Join us as we explore how embracing our grief can lead to profound personal growth and a purposeful life.

RESOURCES:

CONNECT:

In a recent episode of the podcast Grieving Voices, hosted by Victoria, listeners are introduced to the inspiring story of Kenisha Nichelle. As a trailblazer in the sports industry and an advocate for individuals navigating grief, Kenesha’s journey is one of resilience, transformation, and unwavering dedication to helping others heal.

The Early Impact of Loss

Kenisha’s story begins with profound personal losses that shaped her path. At just 12 years old, she faced the unexpected death of her father due to a brain aneurysm. This devastating event left her grappling with immense grief during a time when mental health awareness was limited. Without adequate coping mechanisms or support systems in place at that time, Kenesha turned to harmful behaviors as an outlet for her overwhelming emotions.

However, this challenging period also marked the beginning of her healing journey. Her family sought therapy services where she engaged in children’s grief counseling—a pivotal step toward recovery—and discovered color therapy. These experiences not only aided in processing her own grief but later inspired elements within her Brighter Tomorrow Foundation.

A New Chapter Amidst Continued Struggles

The loss didn’t stop there; during college sophomore year came another blow—the aggressive battle with breast cancer claimed her mother’s life too soon again thrusting academic pressures alongside familial responsibilities onto already burdened shoulders causing further struggles academically leading ultimately major switch from athletic training into sports administration opening doors towards new career paths within management fields instead!

Through all these trials though emerged strength unseen before—strength born out adversity itself transforming pain purposefully supporting those walking similar paths today through initiatives like Game Changers United offered under umbrella foundation founded personally embodying authenticity resilience commitment empowering hope-filled futures ahead despite hardships endured along way thus far…

Episode Transcription:

Victoria Volk: Hey, hey, hey, welcome to another episode of grieving voices. If you’ve been here a while, thank you for coming back if this is your first episode. Welcome today my guest is Kenisha Nichelle. She is a trailblazer in the sports industry and a passionate advocate for those navigating grief. Having overcome profound personal losses, including the deaths of her father and mother, Kinesha has turned her pain into purpose. She has made significant contributions to organizations like the Miami dolphins, in the Super Bowl Committee, and she founded the brighter Tomorrow Foundation Incorporated, which provides innovative resources for individuals dealing with grief. Kenisha is also the creator of game changers united, a platform designed to support athletes and overcoming life’s challenges. Her work is characterized by authenticity, resilience, and a deep commitment to helping others find hope and healing. Kanisha’s mission is to inspire and empower individuals to live and not merely survive. Thank you so much for being here. Absolutely. I think we’re of the same mindset, so you are in the perfect place.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Thank you. Thank you.

Victoria Volk: Yes. So thank you for what you’re about to share, and I’m happy to meet you.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Likewise, I’m always grateful for the opportunity to share. So thank you, Victoria, for having me.

Victoria Volk: So I was reading looking through your website and things, and I was a childgriever. My father passed when I was and I read that your father had passed when you were twelve, unexpectedly.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Yes.

Victoria Volk: And one thing I found interesting in reading was that color therapy was introduced to you And I thought, well, that’s interesting. And I dug further and it’s that you’ve incorporated that into the brighter tomorrow foundation. And we’ll get to all of that. We’ll need to talk about all of that. But first, it’s what led you to where you are today. Are those losses in transforming your pain into purpose, which has another conversation I wanna get. Yeah. Close, but a pin in that. But please share with me and our listeners the impact of being a child retriever in growing up with it, really, because that’s what we do as child grieving, which is very different when you lose a parent as an adult. Right?

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Right. Yes. So it was unexpected. My father was a police officer. And so he was at a routine training. They were in the classroom. They weren’t out in the field. And he was just, you know, in his in the classroom, and we got told that he came back from lunch and just collapsed to the floor. I was in school, and so my mother came and got me from school and pulled me out and said, you know, your father is being rushed to the hospital we have to go, so we went. Somehow, I don’t know the timing, but somehow we beat them there?
Or we got them, like, right at the same time? Because I can’t remember seeing him come out of the ambulance and being, you know, brought into the emergency room. As they were working on him and things, we later found out that it was a brain aneurysm He had so the story that I’ve been told was that as a child, he was swimming and dove hit first into the pool one time, and it left a permanent cut. On his head. So we don’t know if that had something to do with, like, it was just there and no one behold, it ruptured, but it was a brain aneurysm. And so that was on a Wednesday. By Saturday, he was declared brain dead. Mhmm. And so that’s literally unexpected. Like, we didn’t know how my parents were divorced. So when my parents divorced, I I opted to live with my father because I was a daddy’s girl. Things unconventional and most daughters go with their moms, but my dad had a had a really good relationship. So, you know, that was my world. That’s where I live. That was everything. He had, you know, since remarried at the time, but it was my world. And it tore me to shred. You know, I had lost my great grandmother before then, but that’s the only death that I had experienced at that age. And so, yeah, at twelve, shook my world upside down. And, you know, I tried to well, I didn’t try I went back to school and, you know, would do things in his honor, but it was tough.
It was tough because I’m like, okay, what happens now? You know, I have a mom, but I’m living with my stepmother so that kinda got a little dicey little bit. And then, you know, courts got involved and all those kind of things, and it weighed on me, like, the stress weighed on me to the point to where I started to cut myself because I just didn’t know how to process pain. You know, this is nineteen ninety nine. Mental health is not even a thing. Then so, you know and it was with the butter knife. It was something trivial, but, you know, it was still I was lashing out. I was, you know, trying to do something to amass the pain. And my family, they eventually sock therapy. And it would they put me in a children’s grief counseling class, and I think we probably once a week or so. And it was there where I was introduced to coloring and art therapy that it’s just it’s a therapeutic tool, you know. It’s not meant to take away any pain or anything like that, but it is a safe outlet for you to reprogram your minds and to get your mind off of what it’s going through, like, you know, all the process and then all the questions and all the what if. In this particular moment, you know, you have the opportunity to just be. And it obviously makes sense for a child, you know, to do it. But I encourage adults to do it as well because I always say you have got to get that paint out somehow because just like a balloon, it will fill up and fill up and fill up until it bursts.
And you don’t know what that thing is going to be that will make you burst. Right? So you have to process your thoughts and feelings in some sort of way. And so I just, you know, went back to that technique because fast forward when I lost my mother, it came back up as in my life again.

Victoria Volk: And how was that experience different? I mean, being twelve, preteen, like, middle school, that is Yeah. Top of my head anyway. Yeah. And in college. Mhmm. I think mothers. So very pivotal

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Times in your life. How does

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: that work? And I’m the only child. So, you know, it’s not like I had a brother’s sister that we could kinda cling to each other to go through this. It was just me. So that was equally as tough. I won’t say unexpected, but it was breast cancer and kinda showed up out of nowhere. And it was stage three, so it was pretty aggressive when she found it. I will say in my personal opinion, she opted to have a lumpectomy, just the removal of the tumor versus having a mastectomy. I think that is the difference between her not being here today or at least having a few more years, but that’s just neat. But, you know, like I said, they were divorced, so I understand her reasons now as a grown woman. She didn’t wanna go through that. But that was it was a lot too because, again, yes, I was I was a sophomore in college when she was first diagnosed. And so here I am. I went to school about an hour away from our hometown. And I did that because, you know, I wanted to freedom of being away, but also the security of being close.
I didn’t know when I went to school that that was gonna really be a thing that played a role in my life, but it did. And so it did. Yeah. It allowed me to be able to get back home for appointments and chemo and just be there as a support. But in this game called balance, something else suffered and what suffered was my classes. Right? I wasn’t either going to classes or I was failing because I wasn’t studying. So that became a lot to to handle and to manage.

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Kenisha Brown-Alexander: And it didn’t take long. You know, she She had it. She went into remission. We took a trip to New York. It was Christmas. Well, no. Thanksgiving of two thousand and six. And she’d never been and we wanted to go. So we went to New York, and she started having really, really bad headaches on the plane. We got back. She got tested. Found out that the cancer hadn’t metastasized to her brain. And so we had to go through that. It was a long haul. And then that was January. And I would say by late May, June, it had then metastasized again to her lungs to where it was pretty much throughout the body. And so she passed July thirteenth of two thousand seven.

Victoria Volk: So after your father passed and you moved in with your mother. Yes?

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: I did. Yeah. I eventually did. You just didn’t seem right to stay with my stepmom. So I did.
I moved in with my mom.

Victoria Volk: Did that improve? I mean, you improved your relationship with your mom so that by the time of basic college you were

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Yeah. It did. We had a strained relationship prior to, again, I was a daddy’s girl, so I opted to live with him. You know, she didn’t understand it. But then, you know, she got on board with it. But, you know, she want she went to live in her life, you know, she started dating other people and things. And so there were become times where those men, if you will, got put before me. And so that kinda strained our relationship. So when he passed and I, you know, finally made the decision to live with her. You know, I had a very adult conversation. A hindsight is twenty twenty, and I probably like, if my daughter was to do this to me, I’d be upset. But I had a very adult conversation with I said, no, ma’am. I’m gonna come live with you, but you can’t have a boyfriend while I’m here. Now when I leave for college, you do whatever you want. But while I’m here, you can’t. And I let’s just say I was fifteen. Am this. And that’s wild to me now. But I did, you know, I didn’t know any better. And honestly, she listened.
At least she listened

Victoria Volk: to hear your wishes.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Right. Unless she had a boyfriend that I didn’t know about to get a really good job of, you know, keeping it hush, but I didn’t know. So to me, there wasn’t anybody in the picture. So that helps our relationship, you know, that, you know, put us back on track if you will. And so, yeah, we became, you know, good mother and daughter. Obviously, when I came with an adult eighteen, you know, friends, if you will, you know, still my mom, of course. But, yes, it our relationship improved. And then even when I got off to college and things, you know, I was always there for her before the cancer, you know, just always doing things and taking her lunch and things like that. So, yes, it our relationship improved and then, you know, that happened. And so that put me full force to wanna be there as much as I can.

Victoria Volk: And it also changed your trajectory in college as well. Did it not a little bit?

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: It did. It did. So I originally went to school because I wanted to be a doctor. I love to help, you know, I love medicine. So I just knew I was gonna be a pediatrician. Right? Just kind of the go to thing. I got into my first class, and it was horrible. I was like, nope. I can’t do this. All the ions and neurons and all of the things with with chemistry. And I was like, no, this is not it. But I love sports. And so just watching football games you know, seeing the players get injured and the people run into the field, I began to question who were they. Mhmm. And so I found out those were athletic trainers and I was like, oh, that’s cool because it’s still kind of medicine ish a little bit. But it’s sports. So that seems like fun. So I changed my major to athletic training, and then I ended up getting an opportunity to be a student athletic trainer at my school, University of Kentucky. And so that was fun. Like, you know, I got assigned to the track and field team. So I got to, you know, travel with them and be at practice. So I had basically the same schedule as an athlete, still maintaining pool class lows and trying to, you know, have a social life. And that’s when I got the call that my mother was diagnosed with cancer. Mhmm. It was actually pretty terrible how I found out. So I was at home just, you know, relax or whatever, and I got a phone call from a church member. And the church member was like, hey, Kanisha, I just wanna let you know that I’m praying for you and your mom. Everything is gonna be okay. You know, you guys are gonna make it, she’s gonna be fine, and I’m like, what are you talking about? And all I hear was, oh my god, you don’t know. Okay. And so we’ll say this was when day, like, Wednesday night bible study or something like that. My mom had told them, but she knew I was coming home for the weekend. Mhmm.
So she was waiting until I got home because she didn’t want me to be frantic and get on the highway. Everything that she didn’t want me to do. I did. Because when that phone call was over the next call, mother, what are these people talking about? And so she was like, yeah. Well, I didn’t wanna tell you with the phone. I I knew you were coming home this weekend, so I was gonna tell you when I saw you. Okay, girl. I’ll see you in an hour. And I drove up. She’s like, no, don’t do that. Bye because you can’t stop me. So I went home and loved on her and I think because I think that was like a Wednesday if I had to guess. So bump classes Thursday and Friday didn’t care, you know, I was gone. So that’s how I found out. Pretty awful. But I was there, you know, full force. But like I said, I started failing classes because I wanted to be there. And my grandmother was obviously taking care of her her mom and she has siblings and family and, you know, friends that were there, but it’s still I felt responsible as her daughter. So I would begin to fail classes and not go and, you know, struggle and all of those kind of things so that fast forward when she did pass away. And I’m pretty sure you’re gonna ask me about what happened after that, so I skipped it. But I then long term knew that I needed my support system, so I ended up transferring to my the school in my hometown so I could be close to my support system because after an incident, I realized that just an hour was too far. And so I end up changing my nature because they told me I needed three years to to I wanted to stay being a trainer, I would need three years to undo all of my grades and I’m like, I don’t have three years so I ended up switching to sports administration. And so that’s how I got to where I am today.

Victoria Volk: Which turned out to be a blessing in disguise too.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: It did. It did. There’s a little piece of me that still, you know, misses that my daughter is starting to play basketball now and so she she’s gotta pull me out of retirement. I’ll do massages. And I’m like, okay. Do I need to tape your ankle and all that kind of stuff? So I’ll, you know, still kind of practice every now and again. And, you know, I had big hopes and dreams of what that would look like. But hindsight’s always twenty twenty, and yes, had and it’s weird, you know, I’m sure you can relate. Had certain things not happened, we wouldn’t be here. And I honestly believe, like, Had I not lost my mother, I probably wouldn’t even have my daughter because I would have never ended up in Miami. And so I can trace my life all the way back to that moment. So if it had worked out, I have no idea what now would even look like because I probably wouldn’t even be in Miami, honestly.

Victoria Volk: I’m getting full body chills. Oh, that’s just that sounds good to me.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Yeah. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: And I’m seeing behind you if people just listening to

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: people who

Victoria Volk: can’t see the screen, but where there is hope, there is faith, and where there is faith miracles happen. You really do weave in your Christian faith and believe system into the work that you do, into the foundation and all of that. And so at any point, because I can imagine I mean, I know what it I know what losing my father in things that happened after that. Did to me and it really made me hate God for a long time.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: I did. I did.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. You struggled for a while, ma’am.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: I did. I did. Because I didn’t understand why. Like, I’m twenty one. I’ve accomplished nothing.
The only thing I have is a high school diploma. So what am I still going to school for? What what am I even trying for? I have no clue what to do. You know, I think I figured out my life’s career in this athletic training, but I didn’t fill classes, so that’s not gonna work. So, yeah, I was very upset. And I was you know, I grew up in the church, loved guys, and in the choir, taught, Sunday school, did all of the things. And so immediately it didn’t hit immediately. I think I probably went to church, you know, right after she passed. And, of course, you know, the funeral was at my church and things. But slowly, but surely, I started to break down. I started to, you know, why me, of course, and then just why, you know, why I I didn’t ask for this. I didn’t I don’t think I’ve done anything wrong, you know, all of those type of questions. And so while those questions aren’t filtering and while, you know, I’m slowly but surely disconnecting myself from God is when I would say my breaking point happened. And so, like I said, I was a athletic trainer. When I returned to school in the fall, I was then assigned to the women’s basketball team. And I was really looking forward to that. I’m like, okay. Because if you know anything about men’s basketball, Kentucky is it’s the mecca. And so to be part of the women’s team and be kind of in the same space, it was cool. Right? And so I was excited about it. And I would smile during the day and I would steal, you know, just booh, cry at night because grief tends to hit the worst at night. But it was Labor Day weekend, and I wanted to go home and see my family. And because, again, I’d been to school probably about a month. At this point. So I’m like, okay. It’s a long weekend. I can go home. I can get a home cooked meal.I can get loved on. And I’ll be good. And my supervisor told me I couldn’t go home. And that’s that pin that bursts my bubble. I and again, like I said, all those other feelings that I was having about life in general was all festering inside. And then to be told, I couldn’t go home for a reason that I don’t understand. She didn’t have a reason. You know, we weren’t in season which would have made sense like this is, you know, the first of September. What are we doing? And that was the last day that I was a trainer.
I took my keys off my key ring and I put it on the table and I said I quit. Will not be doing this anymore. And I walked out. I went to my apartment in Lexington, changed my clothes, got in my car, drove to Louisville. I stopped at the drugstore, and picked up some pills. I went to the liquor store and got some alcohol. And then I went to my aunt’s house because that’s where I would crash when I would come home for the weekend. And I consumed them both. I got in the bed and I said, I hope I never wake up. Because I was like, I can’t do this. I I’ve got nothing else to give. I texted my boyfriend at the time and said, you know, I love you, but I can’t do this, and I cut off my phone. And that was my breaking point. But I’m still here. And I’m grateful and thankful. And it was because of that that I didn’t realize, okay, that there is a God. Because even though I was feeling those things and I was angry and I wasn’t praying and I wasn’t doing all of the things, he still found a way to save me because it didn’t have to. It could have been the end. And so that landed me in a mental hospital for four days. It was It was a terrible experience, but it was what I needed, you know. It was scary. It was rough. But I needed that. I needed to see that, yes, life is pretty horrible right now for you. There is somebody else who has it worse. I was not being beaten up. I had not been raped. I had not been beaten and left. You know? There were that was my roommate story, actually.
And so I wasn’t that even though this was that, it wasn’t that. And so, you know, I believe that, you know, God allowed me to see those things of and it’s unfortunate for them. Again, I’m not, you know, passing any judgment or anything at all, but allow me to see that there’s other people that are going through other things that you’re not. So let’s be grateful and thankful you still have a family. They found you.
They brought you here. You know, they wanna make sure you’re taken care of. So I had to find some sort of thankfulness in that just a little bit of peace. Mhmm. And that is what started me on the path of kinda rebuilding my hope and and trust in faith. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: So you changed your major again. Right? That’s right.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Yes. So after that stay is when I realized I was like, okay. I can’t do this. I can’t stay. I need to transfer when I know, did all my paperwork, talked to the advisors, I wanted to stay with athletic training, which was Kinesiology and exercise science. But that’s when they told me, well, you can. But you’re gonna need three years to make up everything that you’ve you know, failed. And I was like, I don’t have three years. I’m gonna end up quitting and probably living a life that would not be pleasing to my parents. So what else can I do?
And that’s when they suggested sports administration. They say, well, you have enough credits on this side you know, to transfer over to where we can get you out in a year and a half. And I was like, okay. I can do that.

Victoria Volk: And here you are. And here I am. Yes.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: That that year and a half called for an internship. And most know, students, they still they do it in Louisville. They’ll do it at the university, somewhere close by. But I took it as a unique opportunity to spread my wings and to see what was out there. And so long story short, I ended up getting my internship with the Orange Bull Committee which is in Miami. And I think that that was driven by the universe because in Kentucky, like, this time of year, it’s cold, the sun never comes out, it’s seasonal depression, it’s ugly, it’s all of the things on top of grief. And I was just like, I that was the reason I needed to go. I was like, I need to go somewhere else where it’s not this. And lo and behold, I ended up in the Sunniest place in all of the United States. So I was like, I’m gonna do it. I’m gonna take a leap of faith that I’m gonna go. Never been to Miami, never been for spring break, didn’t know anything about it, more than what I saw on TV. But I decided to bet on myself and just to see what would happen. And it was because of that how I’m doing the things that I get to do today.

Victoria Volk: And where do you live now?

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: I still I’m even lying. Yeah. I’m still lying.

Victoria Volk: I never left the sunshine.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: We left so I got down the line. I got married. And We spent a couple of years in Atlanta, so from twenty six no. Twenty fifteen to twenty eighteen. We did leave Miami and go to Atlanta at the time my grandmother, my father’s mother, was really, really close to. Her health was starting to fail. And so it was beginning to get a lot to travel from Miami to Kentucky. And so and then things were happening in my career. I was like, okay. I can afford to, you know, get a change of scenery, change of environment. So going back to Kentucky was not an option, but I wanted to get close enough to where I could at least drive, you know, if I couldn’t catch a quick flight. And so we ended up going to Atlanta for those three years. And I feel like it served as purpose, you know, it allowed me to see her more within the course she passed away. And so when she passed and my husband got another opportunity back here at Miami that brought us back in twenty eighteen, and so been here ever since.

Victoria Volk: And I read that you started brighter tomorrow foundation during the pandemic.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: I did. I did. So again, sports, everything is shut down. I had just gotten a new job working for, we’ll call it a organization that does summer camps, summer basketball camps on college campuses. Pandemic. Everything’s closed. There’s no camps. There’s no nothing. So as quickly as I was hired was as quickly as I was or my position was eliminated, if you will. And so, yeah, I’m stuck with okay, what to do now? Because there’s nothing. No sports know anything. But I’m obviously seeing that with COVID, we’re losing people. I mean, the numbers obviously, you know, was insane. And so it made me just kinda think, you know, alright, Kenisha. You have been exactly where these people are. Right? Maybe not in the same way, of course. I won’t be, you know, just respectful like that, but, you know, you understand the grief, the pain of losing a loved one. And so what can you do to help? And so I’m like, okay. I I think I’m ready to tell my story. The full story because up until that point, I would only tell bits and pieces. Right? I would tell about being a caregiver, so I started an organization for caregivers, which was a lot of fun and very rewarding. Right? I feel like caregivers are the unsung heroes. They’re the ones who take their loved ones to the appointments. Sometimes they get mistreated because loved ones aren’t frustrating and so they lash out on them. It’s a lock that goes into being a caregiver. So I would hold host caregiver day out branches just to give them enough opportunity to be with other people and to talk and, you know, have some fun and eat and shop. And, of course, when the pandemic hit, I couldn’t do those anymore. So I’m like, okay. So that part of the story, I I can’t I mean, I can’t share, but I can’t share. Right? So the next part of the story is grief. And so I enrolled into a speakers program. And in that program, you know, they ask, well, what is the one thing that you can talk about that you don’t have to Google? Because I was getting caregiver questions about things that I didn’t understand, like, you know, talking about dementia. I haven’t experienced that. I can empathize, but I don’t know what that feels like. What? I can talk about grief all day and all night. And I don’t have to Google or check anybody for that. And so that is when I started to be more vocal about my story and about the grief that I had experienced losing both of my parents. And so from there, it turned into, okay, how can I help people? And I’m sure people, you know, wanna talk, need therapist. Obviously, I can’t quite be a therapist because that requires more training, but I could be a light coach. And I can’t help people navigate the gap in the middle between where they are and where they hope to be in spite of this grief because as we all know when we’re in it, we can’t see the light of day. Right?
All we see is what’s right in front of us, and we don’t think that this is ever gonna go away. This is the way the life is gonna always gonna be. And being on the other side, I can tell you that that is not necessarily true. I’m not saying that it is not painful. I’m not saying that the journey is not long. But I am saying that with time, And with intentionality, you can still live a good life in spite of the loss. And so that is where all of this came from.

Victoria Volk: In action, taking action?

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: In action. Yes. Yes. You know? I had to be intentional in the in the moment. And it started as another name. It was the grief institute. And then I ended up kinda pivoting and changing the name simply because I one day and I haven’t started doing it yet. But I am prayerful for the day where I can, you know, do gala and do scholarships in my parents’ honor and memory and, you know, be able to give to students who have lost parents and but they’re still trying to keep going too. Right? I very much have a soft spot for those students, of course. Right? And so those are the big dreams, and that’s why ended up switching it to a nonprofit so I could be able to do more work in this space and be able to help as many people as I can.

Victoria Volk: Well, in your other organization

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Oh, game changers.

Victoria Volk: Yeah, United.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: So it’s not a sub organization. I’ve actually decided to keep it under brighter tomorrow foundation because the mission really is the same. Right? It’s to support and give resources. So it’s a program under brighter tomorrow foundation. But what I have discovered again, working in sports, I see a lot. I am a college professor too, so I interact with students and I get to literally be with them and talked to them and hear, you know, when they don’t show up to class and then I find out that a cousin was shot and that’s why they couldn’t come because they couldn’t handle it and it was a lot of pressure, it took me back to my story and my journey. So there is relatability in that space because I have walked that walk. And, you know, unfortunately, students against today are struggling with balance. It’s a lot of pressure. And we have seen and I have seen that students, unfortunately, don’t feel that they have an outlet and they too attempt suicide. It has been an epidemic However, this time, literally, this time last year while I was teaching, we found out that there was a young lady on the basketball team who committed suicide, and that felt too close to home to me. Even though I didn’t have her as a student, I had one of her teammates in my class. She was a part of women’s basketball team. So, you know, had to walk with her and encourage her in this grief. It just made me realize, like, they’re going through a lot and I know what it feels like to be dealing with a lot and feeling like looking at left to right that nobody understands. Like, I’m literally the only person on the face of the fur of this Earth that’s experiencing this. And then we know that’s true. We all are dealing with things, but nobody talks about it. Or there’s not a safe space to be able to talk about it. And so that’s why I wanted to start this program for college campuses specifically so that they can have a safe space to walk in a room and say, alright, we may not be dealing with the exact same things, but we’re all attached to sports in some capacity. Right? You’re either a trainer, a manager, you’re just a student as a future administrator where you’re an athlete. But I’m trying to maintain my grades because I’ve gotta be eligible, but life has still happened. My mother was diagnosed with cancer. My grandmother just passed away. And so the idea is, yes, I can come in and speak and give you know, speeches, if you will, inspirational speeches and tell my story. I host workshops in group settings, so you can get hands on tangible tools and information to be able to walk with it and take it with you as you continue on your journey. But big picture is I see just individual chapters on college campuses to wear their student lid, their peer lid, perhaps they are facilitated by future therapists. Right? So they’re getting the opportunity to get practical hours by facilitating the conversations with their classmates. But these these students connected to sports now have a safe space maybe once a week or every two weeks to gather with others who understand the the nuances of trying to balance it off. And it came to me well, not necessarily came to me. I always knew I wanted to do something like this, but it was magnified when I kinda tested this in my class last year. Again, I’m a very practical, experiential professor.
The book is it’s alright. But I believe that students really need that real life experience. I’ll give them, you know, real scenarios that I have experience and, like, okay. Write about it. Tell me how you would handle it. Like, I think working in sports is hands on. And so, you know, I did kind of a test if you will with my class and putting them in groups and found out that they actually ended up bonding overjust this thing. Like, they got to talk about what they’re dealing with and going through. And it got to the point where I would start to see them come into class together. You know, they would talk. And, like, they became friends. They were not friends before class started, but they left as friends and as a unit, a little small unit, it’s like three of them. But they left, you know, being able to say, oh, I text so so this weekend and, you know, we we we chatted about what we’re, you know, what we we will get coming up next week and you know, just kinda balancing it all and we’re gonna go to the library together and, you know, so I could see it coming together. And I’m like, this is what I’m talking about. This right here, they need to have just some sort of pod, some sort of community to feel as though I’m not alone. And so that is my mission right now. I still work in sports. I still do events and operations and all of the fun things that people like to clap about. It’s okay. This is right here is purpose work. This is what matters most to me right now in this season.

Victoria Volk: And thank you for bringing that up. The purpose piece, because I do wanna talk about that because one of the things that gives you hope for the future is seeing other people

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Find purpose in their pain. And one of the things I was thinking about as I was preparing for our conversation was I talked to a lot of grieving guests just in the work that I do too, but like you and I, I phone purpose in my pain. I was just thinking about how there’s can be this pressure for grievers to find purpose in their pain. Like this like, it’s the next thing I have to do in order to feel better. Right? But the thought came to my mind was perhaps as we work through our grief and we’re sitting in our suffering, maybe the purpose naturally evolves, naturally just shows up for us. But what are your thoughts for those listening who feel like they’ve been waiting for their purpose to be illuminated, and it hasn’t happened for them? Because I can say for me, and I was reflecting as I was writing this question out, and I was just like, well, it took me thirty years. I never thought I’d find purpose in my pain. It honestly Mhmm. My dad passed away. I was eight. I didn’t find my purpose or really feel like I was living my purpose until, well, six years ago.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Yeah. I

Victoria Volk: mean, thirty plus years, thirty five years. Yes. So for people who it’s maybe been five or ten years, and they’re still like, well, what does this experience mean for me? They’re still asking themselves that question.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: A question.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. What what do you wanna say to that?

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Yeah. And I get the I get that question a lot too from my clients. You know? They’re like, alright. Well, what does this all mean?
I mean, of course, we you and I we both ask ourselves that question. What I typically share and what I have found in just in my own personal journey to be true is that the purpose will not be revealed until your heart is prepared for the answer. Mhmm. And I say that because you could not have told me what I close my mother’s casket that I would be doing this work. I don’t care about nobody.
I mean, no. I want my mother. I want my father. So you couldn’t have told me a right connection. It’s just it’s gonna be okay because one day you’re gonna help people. No. No. And so I share that because sometimes we don’t wanna hear that. Right? Especially right out the gate. We don’t wanna hear that. Oh, it’s gonna be okay and, you know, you’re gonna help a lot You don’t wanna hear that. Life still has to move, if you will, to eventually get you to the point where your heart is soft enough to be able to understand that that was the reason. Right? And we all know that everything happens for a reason, we hear that. But it’s in these type of moments when you kinda put it to the wayside, but eventually, it does become true that there is some sort of reason. And it may not be as grand or as big as starting a nonprofit, becoming a therapist, doing things like that. You know, if you are able to encourage one person who is now walking in those shoes, then that could be considered purpose. Right? Because you are now on the other side.
You have gotten through what I like to call is the turmoil and the just the overwhelming despair that I can’t get out of bed. I can’t see, you know, day from night. Like, once you get through that part of it and you’re able to have a conversation and share with someone else, who was down in that space. You know, that can be considered a purpose. But, yeah, I I honestly believe that we’re not in a place to hear that there is going to be purpose to the pain and you’re gonna do something great with this, perhaps, until your heart is ready for that.
And, you know, for me, it was ten years. You know, I reached a point where I literally became exhausted with you know, on angel anniversaries and birthdays and holidays being depressed. I still don’t like holidays. It’s still just that’s kind of my one soft spot where I it does trigger me. I’ve gotten better. I think I finally did decor, like, two years ago, but I wouldn’t I wouldn’t my husband does the Christmas tree. I I refuse to do the Christmas tree because that was me and my mom’s thing. So I won’t do that. I’ll let them do that. And they know I don’t really like Christmas music because that is a trigger. But I say that that, you know, once you get through kind of the the overwhelming part of it, then you’re eventually to a point where you can start to feel, you know, I’m starting to feel better. And so for me, a the ten year mark, for whatever reason, I just got tired, like physically, just frustrated with being upset, and I had to stop and think. Alright. What else is to this? Because I can’t keep living like this, like, like, why? And, you know, it was really revealed to me that I needed to start celebrating that I was still here rather than focusing on that it’d been ten years that they’re not. And so having that mindset shift is what really kinda started to turn the corner of being able to find purpose, if you will, in it all. Because now I can get from the negative side of it, the the hurtful and painful part of it and start to see the brighter side. Right? Brighter tomorrow. I got to start to see the other side of it. And so with that came the the nuances of, you know, just starting to do things that I would consider turning payment to purpose. So I hope that answered the question, but that is that is really kinda how I see it.

Victoria Volk: No. I love that. It’s a very good answer, actually. What was the best advice that you ever received in your healing journey?

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Best advice.

Victoria Volk: Or something that stuck with you that you learned. Maybe even learned about yourself, maybe even that has sustained you or was the thing that kept you to put one foot in front of the other?

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: I mean, big picture would be just wanting to make them proud. I’m still at this big age at that thirty eight. You know, I’m still striving, if you will, to make sure that I’m making them proud. So, you know, a lot of the moves that I make, if you will, or decisions and things that I, you know, want to do or accomplish, it’s in that vein because I do believe they’re my angels. I do believe that they’re with me. And so The biggest thing for me is just to make sure that I am doing whatever I can to make them proud, to honor their legacy, to remember who they were, and not to forget ever, you know, the fabric of who I am because of them. I would say from advice perspective, honestly, it’s just to not sugarcoat the story, and that’s what I did in the beginning. Like I said, I I just not just now. But I would say within the last couple of years, I finally told the full story, like, including the suicide. I believe that part out. And I have discovered that there is relatability and vulnerability. That there is somebody who needs to hear and see that it got that bad. And, you know, gratefully, like I said, I survived it. But what are my tools and and how was I able to overcome and get through it so that the next person who may feel like they’re reaching that point can see that I can overcome. And so I began to tell the story, the the full story without any hesitation or reservation of judgment or anything. And I think that that has what’s really helped me to help people is to share the whole thing. You know, obviously, I I filter and feel, you know, when is it necessary. I don’t go all in immediately, of course. But just listening to people, having a listening ear, and then just being able to share so that somebody else could see that, no, you can get through it too. So I would say those two just keeping an open heart of wanting to make my parents proud even in their absence and then just being honest and transparent really, you know, because you never know who’s listening, who’s watching, and who may be at their breaking point too. Well, and I was just I was thinking too

Victoria Volk: a lot when you were talking with the college students and things. It’s like, even the college that my son goes to, there’s a lot of international students. So they’re going through if they’re going through something really challenging, Mhmm. And they’re an international student, like, they’re feeling quite possibly feeling really isolated.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: So I love your mission statement or I love your I love that that’s part of your mission because, you know, of course, I didn’t have a college student till a couple years ago. But I’ve actually had well, yeah, he’s been in college now a year and a half, but I told him I said, you know, for the students that are from out of state or whatever I said, see if they want to come here for visit, you know, come get some home cooking because otherwise they’re stuck,

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: you know, literally stuck. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. So anyway, I I just thank you for your advocacy work. I think there’s really something there because I I can see that there’s probably a huge gap. In that Yeah.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: I mean, I’ve got big vision for that right there. So that’s something that I would love to be able to do, you know, for the students who can’t go home for the holidays. Right? You know, maybe we can as an organization, can do a thanksgiving together or at the very least give them a gift card to be able to eat, you know, something like that. Yeah. I’ve never thought everything through, but those are the type of things that are on my mind. Because as as you know, playing a sport, sometimes you even have to play. You know, basketball season is still in. They may have they can’t go home. You know, maybe as a team, they do something, but you gotta go back to your dorm room and you’re by yourself. So those type of things that you’re speaking of is exactly what this is about. You know? I’m trying In some way, to eliminate isolation, to eliminate the feelings of, it is just me and me only.

Victoria Volk: It’s almost the flip side of, you know, there’s organizations like adopt a grandparent or something like that. We’re grand like, and the elderly that have no family

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Yeah. Like,

Victoria Volk: can adopt somebody, you know, and I’d like to check-in on them and send them care packet

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: back at yeah. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: And then my colleague my son’s college does that where you can sign up to send your child, like, care package, but it’s like, okay. Well, what if the kid is doesn’t have their parents. Right? Or my parents isn’t involved in their life really or Right. Yeah. You know? So, yeah. Anyway, I think there’s a there’s a lot you can do there. Queen you on.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Thank you. Thank you.

Victoria Volk: What is there let me ask you this final question. Mhmm. What is your grief taught you?

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: I don’t think I’ve ever been asked that. Oh, what has my grief taught me? Patience for one because everything takes time. And as much as I would love to rush the process, get through it, get to the other side. There is something to be learned along the way. You know, I have much compassion and empathy for people who are experienced it. I also have less of a tolerance for people who mistreat their parents and, you know, I I get it. We’re in a age where there’s boundaries and and all of those kind of things. But, you know, at the end of the day, I am one of the ones that will say, but there’s still here. You know, I wish I could. And so, you know, I understand relationships are not always perfect. But, you know, I definitely advocate for try to have healthy relationships with your family and try to see them because you know not the day or the hour that they will be gone, and there is no going back. So,

Victoria Volk: like

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: I said, as patients on one side, you know, advocacy on the other side for, you know, men in relationships and things. And then I would just say, just loving on people, really. I’m sharing these stories with my daughter. You know, she obviously had never met my parents. You know, I do the best that I can to keep their legacy live. I actually I think, numbers this year, my stepmother found old videos. And that was a lot to endure, you know. But, yeah, I there’s a company that will convert old home videos into digital format, and I was actually able to see it here by dad’s voice. For the first time in twenty five years, you know, and that was wild. I still haven’t looked watched all of them yet. But, you know, just keep memories alive, you know, as best as you can, as much as you can. Yeah. I think those are kind of the biggest things that it’s taught me.

Victoria Volk: Is there anything that you would like to share that you didn’t feel you got to?

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: I think I won’t say I didn’t share it, but I I kinda drove over it, if you will, that in spite of what it feels like and in spite of what it looks like at this moment, I promise you can and you will get through the pain of the loss and still live a good life. I know at times it doesn’t seem like that. At times, you know, you may feel like your head is barely above water, but trust and belief that as long as you Hold on to the memories, of course. But also love yourself enough to know that you’re still here. That means you still have purpose. That means you still have something to contribute. To this big old world that we’re in. And so your loved one that you’re missing is cheering you on and they want you to go and do and be this best person that you can until you get to see them again. And so I just wanna remind whomever may be listening or watching this that life is to be lived, you know, not merely just surviving. You know, you can have all these big goals and dreams, and that’s fine. But also remember that you deserve to have purpose. You deserve to smile. You deserve to have good days even in spite of the loss. And triggers may come and memories may come up and bring up feelings. But just know that you know, you deserve to live, you deserve to have a good life in spite of the loss.

Victoria Volk: It’s a beautiful way to wrap up. Today’s episode. Thank you so much.

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Thank you for having me. I appreciate it.

Victoria Volk: And where can people find you if they’d like to connect and learn more about your work?

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: Yes. So I am on Instagram, and my website is both Kanisha and Michelle. That’s in as a Nancy, not Michelle, but Michelle. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Alright. I will link to that in the show notes. And, yeah, thank you so much for being here today and sharing

Kenisha Brown-Alexander: your screen. Not a problem. Thank you. Greatful to do it.

Victoria Volk: And remember, when you unleash your heart, you unleash your life, much love.

Ep 229 Angela Clement | Love Endures, Even After Loss

 

SHOW NOTES SUMMARY:

In this powerful episode, I sat down with Angela Clement, who shared her moving journey of losing her husband Blaine to stage four colon cancer in October 2021 after 35 years together. Their life on their ranch underwent dramatic changes when Blaine fell ill, leading to multiple transitions, including selling their ranch, Angela’s early retirement as a school principal, and relocating to be closer to medical care. Through her journey, Angela discovered the transformative power of energy healing, which helped Blaine with his symptoms and became her pathway to healing and her new purpose in life.

Angela went on to share how the traditional narrative of “grieving for a lifetime” didn’t resonate with her spirit, leading her to choose a path of active healing through grief coaches and energy healers. Her dedication to healing led her to become an energy healer, grief coach, and author of her book, “Awakening Through Grief.” We explored the importance of processing emotions, particularly anger, and creating safe spaces to feel our feelings fully.

One of the most beautiful insights Angela shared was her understanding that love is infinite and expansive – comparing it to how having a second child doesn’t diminish the love for the first, showing how loving again doesn’t diminish the love we hold for those we’ve lost. She spoke movingly about how Blaine continues to be present in her life as a guiding angel, teaching her that love transcends physical boundaries. Angela now supports others through group sessions, healing programs, and angel readings, helping them find hope and meaning after loss. Her story is a powerful testament to how grief can transform into purpose and healing.

RESOURCES:


CONNECT:

_______

NEED HELP?

  • National Suicide Prevention Lifeline: 1-800-273-8255
  • Crisis Text Line provides free, 24/7 support via text message. Text HOME to 741741 to connect with a trained Crisis Counselor

If you are struggling with grief due to any of the 40+ losses, free resources are available HERE.

CONNECT WITH VICTORIA: 

Navigating Grief and Transformation: Insights from the Grieving Voices Podcast

Grief is a universal experience, yet it remains one of the least understood aspects of human life. The “Grieving Voices” podcast, hosted by Victoria from The Unleashed Heart, seeks to change that narrative by fostering open conversations about grief. In a recent episode, Victoria delves into this delicate subject with Angela Clement, a former school principal who has transformed her personal journey through loss into a mission to help others heal.

Embracing Vulnerability in Grief

Angela’s story begins with an unimaginable loss—the death of her husband Blaine to stage 4 colon cancer in October 2021. This pivotal moment propelled Angela on a path toward energy healing—a practice she had previously explored during her son’s illness and her own health challenges. Through these experiences, she discovered that vulnerability was not only acceptable but essential for healing.

Societal Norms and Emotional Suppression

During their conversation, Angela reflects on societal norms that often dictate how we should handle emotions like anger or sadness—typically encouraging suppression rather than expression. These early messages can complicate our ability to grieve openly as adults. For Angela, projecting control became second nature during Blaine’s illness; however, she later realized the importance of acknowledging all emotions as part of the healing process.

Energy Healing as a Catalyst for Change

Energy healing played an instrumental role in Angela’s transformation from grieving widow to healer and coach. Her commitment led her to organize online summits featuring over 100 grief experts and penning “Awakening through Grief,” scheduled for release in 2024.

Practical Applications

For those navigating similar paths:

  • Explore Alternative Therapies: Consider practices such as Reiki or biofield tuning which Victoria also highlights.
  • Seek Support: Engaging with professionals like grief coaches can provide guidance tailored specifically towards processing complex emotions.

Redefining Relationships Post-Loss

A significant theme discussed is how losing Blaine prompted Angela’s reevaluation regarding future relationships—not out of neediness but readiness stemming from self-love first cultivated within herself before seeking companionship externally again someday soon enough!

Love Beyond Physical Realms

Angela emphasizes love doesn’t diminish after losing someone—it expands infinitely when shared anew while honoring past connections simultaneously! Her spiritual practices—including angel readings aimed at connecting clients spiritually back homeward-bound souls—serve testamentary evidence supporting enduring bonds transcending physical separations altogether ultimately proving invaluable tools aiding many along their respective journeys too now likewise embarking upon similar quests themselves today perhaps even…

Ep 228 Jillian Faldmo: Navigating Grief & Loss with Biofield Tuning

 

SHOW NOTES SUMMARY:

In this collaborative conversation recorded for our respective podcasts, I sat down with fellow Certified Biofield Tuning Practitioner (and Biofield Tuning Trainer) Jillian Faldmo.

We discussed the grief journey, the complex emotions that arise when we experience loss, how grief can manifest differently for each individual, and how our respective paths led each of us to energy healing work.

Jillian shares how her early experience with health issues and a feeling of detachment from her father impacted her longing for connection into adulthood.

As we wrapped up our conversation, Jillian and I shared how energy healing and Biofield Tuning, specifically, have improved our lives and how this work has impacted our lives personally and professionally.

May this episode inspire you to explore your emotional world and consider how energy healing, including Biofield Tuning, can support you on your path to healing.

RESOURCES:

CONNECT WITH JILLIAN:

_______

NEED HELP?

  • National Suicide Prevention Lifeline: 1-800-273-8255
  • Crisis Text Line provides free, 24/7 support via text message. Text HOME to 741741 to connect with a trained Crisis Counselor

If you are struggling with grief due to any of the 40+ losses, free resources are available HERE.

CONNECT WITH VICTORIA: 

Exploring the Transformative Power of Biofield Tuning in Holistic Healing

In recent years, holistic healing has gained significant traction as individuals seek alternative methods to address physical and emotional well-being. A fascinating podcast episode from early 2025 delves into this world by exploring energy healing through Biofield Tuning, featuring Jillian Faldmo and a dedicated host. This collaboration between their respective podcasts, “Grieving Voices” and “Grow A Thriving Practice,” offers valuable insights into the intersection of grief experiences and holistic health practices.

The Journey Into Energy Healing

Jillian Faldmo’s journey into energy healing is both inspiring and relatable for many. Initially drawn to nursing with aspirations of helping others, she became disillusioned with traditional healthcare’s limitations in addressing chronic conditions like fatigue, pain, IBS, Lyme disease, and Epstein Barr Virus. Her exploration led her towards holistic approaches such as nutrition therapy before discovering Biofield Tuning—a modality that uses sound frequencies to interact with the body’s biofield.

Through transformative sessions under Eileen McKusick—the founder of Biofield Tuning—Faldmo experienced profound changes herself: reduced anxiety levels coupled with increased stress resilience prompted her decision not just personally but professionally too; leaving conventional roles behind entirely so she could focus fully on energy medicine coaching instead!

Grief & Emotional Disconnection

The conversation also touches upon deeply personal histories related to grief/loss which resonate universally among listeners who have faced similar challenges themselves – whether it be losing loved ones or dealing internally within familial dynamics where emotions often remain unexpressed due societal norms around vulnerability/sharing feelings openly without fear judgment/rejection etcetera…

Episode Transcription:

Victoria Volk: Hello, and thank you for joining me on this very first interview episode for twenty twenty five. Thank you for being here. If this is your first episode you’re ever listening to, this is a great one to start with. And if you’ve been here before, maybe you’ve been along my journey for the past four plus years and have been a loyal listener. I appreciate you, and I thank you for being here and sticking this out with me for this long. And hey, I wanna give a shout out to my listeners in Albuquerque, New Mexico. If you were listening to this, I wanna hear from you because I’ve been tracking my stats for the last four plus years And every year, Albuquerque, New Mexico has the most listeners of my podcast, and I find that really curious and interesting. And so if you are a listener from Albuquerque, I would love to hear from you. And again, thank you for sharing this episode if you are from there and you’ve shared it with those you love. I appreciate you. And I do someday hope to get to Albuquerque, New Mexico for the hot air balloon festival. It’s on my bucket list. So again, thank you so much for listening. And I’m excited about this episode because we talk a lot about energy healing because it’s with fellow certified bio field tuner Gillian Falmo, and she’s also a trainer for bio field tuning. I had been trying to pin her down for an interview for quite some time because I really did want to speak with her and her expertise as a trainer and being a bio field tuner for as many years as she has. And our schedules weren’t aligning and and she has a podcast as well. It’s called Growa Thiving practice, and she will speak about that in this interview as well. But rather than me coming on her podcast and her coming on mine, figured we would do a collaborative recording and both of us just share it on our respective podcast. So if you are in the healing modalities, doesn’t have to be bio field tuning or a tuning practice, but I highly recommend checking out her podcast, grow a thriving practice, which there will be a link in the show notes. But I’m really excited to share this episode because we both speak to our experiences of what brought us to biofuel tuning, but Gillian specifically speaks to the health challenges that she experienced from a young age into adulthood and how bio field tuning helped turn that around for her and really you know, it’s like these breadcrumbs that we can either follow and choose in our lives and pick them up and do something with them or or not. And I think for both of us, we reflect on how differently possibly our lives would have been had we not picked up these tools that benefited us and helped us with our energy as empath as well, because we speak to that, but also in support of other people. So excited to hear what you think of this episode and excited to share it and enjoy. Alright. So Jillian and Victoria are here today to talk about biofuel tuning and we’re gonna weave in some grief and because my podcast, we’re gonna share this on both of our podcast, Minus, Greeting Voices, and yours is.

Jillian Faldmo: Grow a thriving practice podcast. It’s a it’s a podcast for wellness practitioners who want to grow a pack. Practice. It’s all about marketing strategies and also some coaching in there too. Some life and business coach.

Victoria Volk: And mine is all about grief and I talk a lot about energy healing work. And so I’m sure that a lot of practitioners who listen to your podcast will also have experience grief because who hasn’t. Right? And no one has to die for us to experience grief. And so We’re gonna talk about all those kinds of things today and share on our respective podcast, this one episode. You know, efficiency, right, is king. And it’s like why we record two separate podcasts, so we’ll just do this once and done and share it and it’ll be what it’ll be.

Jillian Faldmo: Totally. Such a good idea. That was victorious idea everybody.

Victoria Volk: So I guess I’ll let you take the floor first because I’m curious to learn what brought you to energy healing work, and then I can share how I found my way to it.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Sounds good. Well, let’s just say, I’ve always had an interest in kind of, I guess, the unseen. I’ve always been kind of a magical thinker since the child And I have always also wanted to help people. I remember even when I was really really young, my mom would ask me, what do you want to be when you grow up? And I wanted to be a nurse. I think it’s because I had been to the nurse so many times as a school age kid. I was always at the nurse with a stomachache or something, and I think I just love the the care and attention. Then, you know, just see. The nurse made me feel so good. Like, she was always so caring in all of the schools that I really went to. So I did actually end up becoming a nurse, but it wasn’t It wasn’t what I thought it was gonna be. There wasn’t a whole lot of care that I was experiencing in that industry. There wasn’t the opportunity to care for people. It was really, you know, working with people’s medications and, you know, following following your to do list basically as a nurse doing some charting and just very stressful, very stressful environment. I also let’s see. I don’t wanna jump around too much, but I think what kind of opened my eyes to there being something different than nursing or something I could even integrate in nursing was my own health challenges. In high school, I was diagnosed with chronic fatigue, chronic pain, IVS, Lyme disease, Epstein Barr, so I obviously was not doing very well in high school. Health wise, still haven’t really pinpointed exactly what created that, you know, kind of group of symptoms. Because I didn’t have huge trauma as a kid. I had some trauma. I think maybe what I did with my emotions was internalized them. And so it kind of led to all these health things. So I went on my own healing path after high school in when I was in college and in nursing school. And just started, you know, learning things like like herbal medicine and the importance of nutrition and things like that. And while I was in nursing school, one of my nursing professors she was teaching a side class called holistic nursing. And I was like, well, that sounds cool. And so that was just kind of an introduction to all these different alternative modalities, like acupuncture, herbs, essential oils, energy medicine, sound healing, and I just love that class. I was like, this is why I’m in nursing to be able to help people in this sort of holistic way. And and In that class, holistic was defined as basically it’s like keeping the whole person in mind.
Like it’s not just about the pharmacology and the the symptoms that the person is having, but we want to take into account their environment, their mental health, their physical health, their spirituality, you know, the whole person. So loved that class. She saw how passionate I was about it. And she actually invited me to start the American Holistic Nurses Association, Delaware. I was in Delaware at the time.
Delaware chapter. With her. So I cofounded that chapter with her and we we basically networked with a ton of nurses in the area. We had probably like twenty or thirty. Members, if I remember correctly, and we’ve led that together for a few years. Eventually, I ended up moving to Vermont. And one of my friends told me because he knew how much I just loved energy medicine. He told me I needed to go see this woman with tuning forks because she does some pretty cool stuff with tuning forks and Victoria’s smiling because she knows my And this is Aileen McCormick, the founder of Biofield Tuning. And I had my first session with her in two thousand eleven and didn’t really notice a ton during the session. What I noticed was how grounded she was, how just kind of matter of fact she was, and she was working around my body with tuning forks, validating the experiences I have as a child, the emotional experiences, like, how I dealt with my emotions, you know, things like that. And I was like, wow, this is really cool. And what I noticed after that was just the sense of less anxiety, less stress. My body could relax more, so it was it was like, okay, I’m gonna keep doing this. I think I did jump ahead a little bit with that story because I think leading leading up to that, I had, you know, I was in the holistic nurses association, like, meeting all these cool nurses and trying all these different things I eventually ended up healing my chronic fatigue, chronic pain, all, you know, that whole list of things through music. I was going to, like, different music festivals, around the area, and I think their music festivals get a bad rap because there’s a lot of recreational drugs going on. I did have my time with that, I’ll be honest. But when I was healing myself, I was going to these festivals totally sober and just really enjoying the music. And it it did something to my system, like something really, really healed within me. I was also doing yoga at the time and careful with my diet too. But I knew there was something about music that, you know, was powerful and I wanted to learn more. So anyway, started seeing Aileen as a client And then it took me three years of being her client to finally go, you know what? I think I wanna do this. I think I wanna be a practitioner of this work. And I became certified and I tried to integrate it into my nursing practice, but at the time nobody was really interested in having a nurse who practiced energy medicine. I know that I think it was more accepted in the hospitals like, you know, Ricky, being on cancer units and things like that, but I was working in mental health I was a substance abuse rehab nurse and a psychiatric and mental health nurse. And there just wasn’t really any room for it. So I ultimately decided to leave nursing and to just do bio field tuning full time. And here I am today, I haven’t I don’t think I’ve had my nursing license in, like, five years or maybe even don’t think I practiced as a nurse in seven, but I think my nursing license lapsed. And I wouldn’t have it any other way. I love that having the background of nursing and all that knowledge, but being able to help people in this way with bio field tuning has really been fulfilling and amazing. And so I’m a full time biofuel tuning practitioner. Well, I should define full time. That’s what I do. As a career, and I’m also a life coach who coaches other wellness practitioners to grow practices because I wanna I wanna see this work out there. More and more. And that’s my mission. So I have a practice here in Central Oregon seeing clients in person, and then I also do remote work. And, yeah, that’s That’s how I got here. Did I miss anything?

Victoria Volk: Well, because I talked about grief. I had to ask, you know, trauma is what happens and grief is what’s left. And we don’t have to have these big trauma experiences to have grief. But had you gone through a lot like some losses in your life around that time? Not necessarily that you would have perceived it as trauma or traumatic losses, but had you had have you had did you experience losses in your life, in your childhood, in into your teen years?

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. You know, one thing came up recently that I had this big aha with that makes a lot of sense now. It’s kind of a a complicated story, but to just make it short, when I was when I was eleven or twelve, I I remember my dad kind of disconnecting from me. And I don’t know if it was it wasn’t intentional for sure, but I don’t I think it was I became an adolescent, became I was becoming a young woman, and I don’t know if my dad had some kind of awkwardness about that or maybe I was just being a brat and he just was like, I can’t deal with this anymore. Right? And so I kind of was like, wow, I think that was that was a loss for me. Of course, I didn’t realize it then, but I think it really impacted me in in some way. So and then I think yeah. I think I’ve always like, love has always been something that I really longed for. And I don’t know if I came in with, you know, past life stuff around that, but I also remember, like, my my brother kind of being you know, he was being a brother. He was being, you know, calling me, you know, names and kinda bullying me. I remember feeling kind of heartbroken around, like, I looked up to my brother. I loved, you know, and I still do. But I just I I he was five years older than me. He is five years older than me. And I just I wanted I wanted his love and I wanted his validation and acknowledgement so bad and he would just you’re stupid. He since apologized for that. By the way, he recognized his bad behavior. But but yeah, I think there was some loss in that regard. Just like a having that longing for love and connection even as a young child and being, like, where did it go? Where is it? So yeah.

Victoria Volk: So love wasn’t really something that was shown in affection and physical, ways, hugs, or anything like that. Maybe not even words or how would you describe how love was expressed?

Jillian Faldmo: Well, I think it was when I was especially by my parents when I was younger, but I think when I became more of a teenager that kinda and like I said, I might have been being a total teenage rat. My parents were just like, okay. Like, you need you need your space. We need our space, but I felt it. I think my nervous system felt it. And maybe I was asking for it. But yeah. And so I’m still more trying to, like I’m in therapy now. I’m trying to, like, unwind all that because it’s like, I think when you have a big trauma, it’s like, oh, yeah. This is the thing that, like, created the womb, but it’s one of it’s one’s a little bit more subtle.
It’s like,

Victoria Volk: what was it? Well, and subtle and ongoing. Right?

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, I’m ongoing.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. There’s a lot of similarities in our stories, and I’ll get to mind. But I’m curious, did your parents have losses around that time that you had those diagnoses?

Jillian Faldmo: Interesting question.

Victoria Volk: Let’s

Jillian Faldmo: see. My grandfather, my mom’s dad, that was that was actually pretty traumatic. Just witnessing her get that phone call. I was only six, but she got this phone call that he had passed in a motorcycle accident. So it was it was tragic and it was unexpected. And I remember being in the bathtub and she picked up the phone and she just I watched her just scream and fall to her knees and I was like, whoa, what just happened? Like, you know, I’m six years old and like, I love my mom and you know, just like so as young children are, we’re so connected to our mothers and just seeing her fall apart like that I think was probably pretty traumatic to my system. Now that you mentioned it, And then her mom died when I was nineteen. So that was about, like, when I was happening. I was having the health stuff, maybe fourteen to twenty three, twenty two, or twenty three. So I think her mom died was right in the middle. And then my dad’s parents hadn’t died until much later Maybe there was some job stuff, maybe some loss of jobs or grieving old jobs. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: It’s very, like, just listening to you. It’s like, oh my gosh. It’s like, are you talking about my story?

Jillian Faldmo: Really?

Victoria Volk: Yeah. It’s really bizarre. Wow. I mean, my I had a lot of loss and trauma in my childhood, like, you know, my my grandmother had passed away when I was seven, and then my grand my father passed away when I was eight. So it was my mother who lost her mother. And then and actually, her dad died the year I was born. So she lost her dad few years, you know, within five, six years, she lost her father, and then she lost her husband. And so you can imagine she was, like, emotionally spent. Like, there was no emotional connection there and kind of how you described kind of what happened with you you and your father, like, emotionally disconnected from you. Mhmm. And, you you know, talking about how you were diagnosed with IBS. I was diagnosed with IBS Mhmm. In my teen years. And needed I needed a lot of sleep, and I was gonna go into nursing, and then I had my son and didn’t feel like I could do, like, didn’t think I could do both. I didn’t have the confidence in myself that I could do both. And, you know, it wasn’t until five, six years ago that I discovered Ricky and started to be open to because my healing kind of really didn’t start until, I’d say, until my thirties. Twenty fourteen is when, like, my personal development, like, just really took off. And I thought there was something wrong with me. Like, my my symptoms were really manifesting in again from the same kind of things that I had, not the same kind of things, but similar, like overall pain, Eptiv are reactivated, like these fibromyalgia like symptoms, GI, like, similar to you. Right? Right. It was I know now, for me, it was grief. Mhmm. Just coming ahead, you know, coming to a head again. My youngest was starting kindergarten. I’d closed my photography business that I’d poured, like, ten years of my heart and soul into. So much change. We had moved. Like, we had, you know, big changes in my life and wasn’t connecting the dots until, of course, you know, after I went through grief recovery and I worked through a lot of my anger and resentment and grief from my childhood and all of that, that I recognize that and connected the dots. Like, oh, this is what was happening in my life. This is why this was manifesting. Because grief manifests in our bodies. And it either comes out. We’re we’re like tea kettle.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Either implode or we explode. Mhmm. And like you, I internalized everything. And so I was imploding, you know, and then I would have these bursts of anger you know, these explosions of anger. And I think a part of it is just connecting the dots for ourselves. Like, what’s happening in my life or what was happening in my mother’s life. Right? To kind of bring that compassion in, like, And for me to be able to do that and look at my past and look at that relationship I had with my mother as a result of her experiences that changed her, which then changed our relationship, it really helped to change my perspective. Of her and of her relationship. And I think that’s that’s the transforming thing that happens when we can when we are able to connect the dots like that for ourselves.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Yeah. That makes so much sense. Yeah. So how did you find Ricky then? What what was the kind of catalyst there?

Victoria Volk: You know, I think because at that point, I would have been See, that was about that was five years ago. Almost to the day, actually, last Sunday was my five year anniversary of my Rakey certification. I mean, it was four years into my personal development. I was taking because I at the time, that’s where I was going to. I I thought something was wrong with me. Mhmm. You know, very well. Maybe you did too. Like, sometimes wrong with me. I’m so screwed up. Everyone else has got it all figured out and they’re all put to got everything together and hears me and I can’t get my shit together. You know? So I was taking different programs and, you know, Tony Robbins and reading personal development books. You see a whole bunch of them up there. Mhmm. You know? And just, like, diving into learning about myself and trying to figure myself out. Like, I keep like, I was my own, like, science project or something.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Yep. Just to gain an understanding of, like, how did I get here? And and grief recovery is what helped me figure that out. But what was happening, the more I was working on myself, the more I would I was more open to hearing the intuitive guidance I feel like I was receiving. So I actually just had a a podcast interview earlier. Calls herself an intuitive, but she’s a medium. And was telling her that, you know, I kept hearing Ricky over and over. And I heard it three times, and I’m like, oh, okay. The third time, there’s something to this. Go to Google, had a conversation with somebody that practiced Ricky, was learning that, oh, there’s different lineages. Like, what’s all this stuff? And I ended up finding a practitioner that that I could meet with in person for my certification. And it was a six hour drive, but I took it and I went and had a really profound experience personally. And, okay, this is I’m guessing, I’m doing this, and this is it, and this is pretty amazing. And I went to my that was level one and two. I went finally, did six months later. I went got my rinky master with her. Six months after that, I got my coronah holy fireraki master with her. Now she offers sound bowl healing classes and stuff too. Mhmm. But it didn’t happen until, like, two years ago. So three years doing Reiki, just went down a rabbit hole, which seems to happen a lot and found biofuel tuning through some really differently. I’m like, well, this is bizarre, but this is really interesting. It was with sound, but it was like this machine that you hook people up to and it could, like, translate their energy, like, into sound frequencies or something like that. And that that led me to biofuel tuning.

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, interesting.

Victoria Volk: And when I found biofuel tuning, I’m like, oh, I’m doing this. This is cool. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, it’s just one rabbit hole after another rabbit hole after another rabbit hole. Speaking of rabbit holes, I have one to send you down that is for a two ounce morning shot called magic mind that will improve not only your focus, but also your well-being and energy, all to help you get things done without negative side effects. I’ve been thinking a lot about mental wealth lately. And last month, you know, with the holidays and managing all that I do with my business and family and trying to stay present and keeping My own energy balanced, I realized I needed to invest in my mental resilience, not just for myself, but for my family and the people in my life and clients and things like that. That’s where magic mind came in. They reached out and sent me their focus shots to try along with their deep sleep formula, and I’ve got to tell you, it’s become a game changer in my daily routine. The focus shot has these amazing ingredients that support mental clarity without the jitters you get from coffee. And at night, their sleep formula helps me wind down naturally. What I love most is that magic mind isn’t trying to become some miracle cure. It’s part of a bigger picture of mental wealth that includes sleep, Diet, exercise, and stress management. It’s like building a savings account for your mind, and these shots are just one of the tools that can help you get there. Right now, they’re offering an exclusive deal for my listeners. Forty five percent off, they’re twenty four our bundle, which includes both the focus and sleep formulas. Just go to magic mind dot com slash gvjAN. That’s all caps, gvjAN. Again, that’s magic mind dot com slash g v j a n for forty five percent off. Invest in your mental health and your future self. Well, thank you. Yeah, that’s that’s how I’ve gotten here. Yeah.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. And so now you you do Ricky as well as bio field tuning or is it just bio field tuning or

Victoria Volk: I kinda have my own hybrid. Like, I kinda have my own, like, way that I do it. I bring in elements of Ricky into it. And, of course, if, you know, contraindications come up with certain clients, then I I use more rate key, of course. But but more importantly, I wanna say and I have a question for you too.
Mhmm. But it’s helped me do the work that I do. Like finding energy healing has helped me do the work that I do in my grief work. Yeah. Because

Jillian Faldmo: That makes sense. It’s really heavy stuff.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. And so my question I thought of when I was listening to you and and what was actually posed to me on that interview that I was telling you about or mentioned is because as a child, I needed a lot of sleep and I just I I consider myself an empath and highly sensitive, but not all highly what I’ve learned is that not all highly sensitive people are empaths, but all empaths are highly sensitive. There’s a difference. But would you consider yourself an empath? Absolutely. Okay. So the question that was posed to be by this medium or intuitive was did you do you because when she was talking about because I kinda asked her a question like this, where do you feel like we’re all we’re all mediums in a way? Or do you feel like we’re all intuitive in that way? And and she was like, you know, there’s certain there’s there’s a person. Like, one person might be, like, let’s say you have a person that runs marathons. They’re very they’re very physical person. They have to be moving constantly. It’s really difficult for those people to sit and be still. Right? It’s Yeah. Very hard for them to it’s gonna be harder for them in her experience. She said to connect to spirit. And to be open to the what spirit is trying to tell them. Mhmm. But if you have someone that is not as much as the visit in the like, they have to experience the world in the physical way, whereas someone like an empath it’s not necessarily the case. And but she was saying in her home growing up, like her sister is very empathic and highly sensitive and felt like her sister carried a lot of the emotional weight and almost processed a lot of everybody’s else’s emotions where she didn’t have to. Mhmm. And what that brought because what she asked me then was, like, she said, do you feel like you were processing like, your sibling she asked me if I was a sibling. I said, yeah, I’m the youngest and she said, do you feel like you were processing a lot of your siblings’ emotions? And I said, you know, because my my brother is five years older than me. And then my sister is nine years older than me. And but I would definitely say that I was processing a lot of my mother’s emotions too. And so as an empath, energy healing has been huge for me and the work that I do, and I imagine it has been for you. And so I’ll ask you the same question I was asked. Do you feel like you were processing a lot of the emotions and the people in your house for the people in your household that they didn’t necessarily have to then process for themselves? Like, you were taking it on?

Jillian Faldmo: Think that’s definitely possible. I know I remember just really being keenly aware when somebody was not comfortable or not happy or upset. Or, you know, whatever it was. And I think maybe I processed it, but I also think that that’s probably what I internalized a lot to make, like, oh, it must be me. I must be the problem for this person. Never really getting much clarity about that. So, yeah, I think it’s I think there’s something to it for sure.

Victoria Volk: Yeah, and just listen just I mean, it’s fresh in my mind because I just had that conversation not long ago, and and hearing her ask that question and her saying too, like, you know, you can you can be it. There’s healers and then there’s teachers and healers can be teachers. But for the most part, healers are the ones that are the empaths and are the ones that are you know, the emotional processing tanks for other people, unless we learn how to manage our own Yeah. And kind of sweep our own doorstep. And I the more that I’ve learned how to process my own journey in my past, the better I’ve been able to sit with others in theirs. That’s one of the things I say a lot too in my podcast, like, you know, people that I don’t know what to say. You know, to someone who’s grieving. I don’t know what to say. I don’t know what to do. And, you know, it comes naturally to someone like me or an empath. Right? Just just Right. With people because we can put ourselves in their shoes. That’s not doesn’t come natural to everybody, you know. Yeah. But you don’t have to do or say anything, you can just sit there and be there. Right? You don’t have to do anything.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. I think that’s for me, like, that’s where it’s so natural for me to connect with anybody. Like, I can connect with anybody. And so I never have that kind of, like, social anxiety that some people have about going out. Like, am I am I gonna know what to say or am I gonna find anybody there that I can talked to.
I’m just like, no. I like, that’s so easy for me and it’s not because I feel like I have a I have a lot to talk about, but because I feel like I can really sit with somebody and listen and just understand them. Like, instantly. And I wonder if, like and then I’m thinking back to childhood, like, connection was really something I I longed for and into my teenage years too. And that’s why I have the business that I have today is just really like, when we do bio field tuning, we are in a very intimate setting with someone and we’re we’re basically like, we’re listening to their body, we’re listening to their mind, we’re listening to, you know, what they’re saying and it a space that as a client is a very precious and rare opportunity to have somebody listen so deeply to you, and I just really thrive on that. And then having the the coaching practice that I have where I just bring healers together and we connect, you know, on on live calls every week. Right now, I’m also coordinating in person venues for bio field tuning classes. So it’s just something that I’ve it’s interesting. Something that you can that seems to be something that you’re lacking in childhood, you can then cultivate later on. Like, what you’re talking about too, being able to sit with people.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. How has biofuel tuning changed your life?

Jillian Faldmo: Oh my gosh. Well, it’s interesting because I I am thirty seven now and I’ve been receiving biofuel tuning since I was twenty three. So I know that it has changed my life. I just think I would be on a completely different trajectory, like into when I was in my twenties into my late twenties, into my thirties, I think I would be I think I’d be pretty unhealthy. So it’s really put me on the path to health.
And and because I think it’s been I mean, how many years is that? It’s been fourteen years, which is a good chunk of my my life. Anyway, it just feels so natural to just be, like, here. And we’re Like, I remember I remember the moment I knew biofuel tuning was helping me when I was in a substance abuse rehab facility. And there was a patient that was having a seizure. And as a nurse, what we do is we tend to that seizure, we go grab the injection of ativan, stick it in their arm, and, you know, monitor vitals and all that, might have to do the injection again. But it was something that would just stir up my nervous system incredibly. Like, I hated it. I I mean, I don’t think anybody likes since someone has a seizure, but what it did in my nervous system was like, I was like, this feels like too bad to keep doing. I can’t keep putting myself under the stress. But someone had a seizure and I reacted as call like, I was as cool as a cucumber. Like, I would just I just responded to what was happening in the moment. And I got, you know, I got a little adrenaline jolt. I think that’s normal and natural when you’re in a life saving, you know, situation. But I felt myself come back to back to neutral, back to that, like, centered and calm feeling almost immediately after that situation was over.
Whereas before, I would have been totally stuck in that adrenaline state. So that’s when I knew. I was like, oh my gosh. Like, this is amazing. This has to be from bio field tuning. Also anxiety just diminished after, like, maybe a year of receiving biofuel tuning. I didn’t even know I had anxiety until it was completely gone. I was like, well, this is different. So yeah. And then I just I met my husband mall on this journey. That’s a whole other story. Yeah. It’s I think it’s changed me in a lot of ways. Changed my life in a lot of ways. And also, it’s just weird to kinda look back and go what would life have been like if I didn’t find this work? Where would like, where would I be living? Who would I be married to? You know, what would I be doing for work, and at the same time, I can’t even I can’t even fathom it. I think I’d find it one way or another.

Victoria Volk: It’s like life is made up of these yes, we have these big choices and decisions we have to make, but it’s all these daily collective, minute choices that we also make

Jillian Faldmo: Right.

Victoria Volk: On the daily, you know, for daily experience. And so what Like, how has that changed? Like, your daily, like, self care. Like, self care when you first, you know, in your early twenties till how it’s how has that changed now? And you’re a parent too. Correct? You have children.

Jillian Faldmo: I am a deaf parent. Yep. A very, I’d say, a very dedicated and committed step parent. They’re they’re like my own. They just didn’t come out of me. But yeah, you know, I think with bio field tuning and with just age, decision making has been more about how does this decision feel in my body? What’s a yes feel like? What’s a no feel like? I’m really listening to that. And I think probably without this work, it would have been much slower, meaning that I’d probably, you know, be thirty seven today and still trying to figure out what my yes and my no felt like. In my body. Do you know what I mean? Does that make sense?

Victoria Volk: I do. I’m forty five. I’m a I’m a little bit more time at this game of life than you, but it’s like all I could think of is like, man, I wish I would have discovered what I know now at twenty three rather than forty? Yeah. You know, I mean, so I can speak to that slower pace of growth because like I said, my journey really started in twenty fourteen when I was just so sick and tired of being sick and tired.
Yeah. You just you know, and I had so many different coping mechanisms. In the meantime, that I’d perfected because, you know, from a very young age, I had a lot of practice, you know. So it was like, it took me thirty years to build up all of that emotional gunk. Mhmm. It took me much longer to come to the awareness that there is something better that’s available for me. Mhmm. It’s really difficult to see that when all you feel in your body is like, the suffering feeling, you know?

Jillian Faldmo: Right. Yeah. Especially when yeah. When you’re in physical pain.

Victoria Volk: And that that is one thing too. That so many experience. It’s, again, this manifestation of physical pain and how have you seen biofuel tuning transforming people’s lives from physical pain? Because that’s an unseen thing too. And that’s that’s another layer of grief. Right? Because people don’t necessarily see that.

Jillian Faldmo: Right. That’s actually where I started. So I moved to this little town in Central Oregon. It’s called sisters. You have the opportunity to visit.
It’s just such a little gem but that’s what I started to kind of notice in this community where there’s so many people who are dedicated to their health and they’re exercising and they’re eating right. It’s really inspiring to like be around these people. But still having ailments like, you know, pain in their shoulder or pain in their hip and just like getting totally frustrated with it. And so that’s how I started to really talk about biofuel tuning was like, this is this is the thing to try when you’ve tried all the other things. I mean, ideally, we try it before that. But for these people who are doing all the their quote unquote right things and still not feeling comfortable in their body because they have some pain or they have some injury that keeps coming back is to let’s let’s uncover the emotional origin of this and resolve it from that space and see how that feels. And so I’ve had a lot of success with my clients and just helping their shoulders to free up or helping their hips to free up or even their breath to free up from from working. We don’t even necessarily have to understand what it was emotionally that created the tension in their body. Which is pretty cool, but to just like locate it in their bio field and unravel that tension. I’m working with somebody now who she’s in her fifties and the past seven years she’s just had all the things, like kind of like we were talking about. She’s got some interesting gut stuff going on and blood sugar stuff. She’s she eats so clean and she loves to be outside and hike and, you know, do all the things. But her she’s just really struggling in her body. And so I’ve seen her three times now, tomorrow, Wednesday will be the the fourth time, but she said to me, I’m starting to feel more resilient. And I’m like, cool. I mean, that so that’s an example of, you know, how biofuel tuning can help clients in that way who who have been struggling. And she’s still not quite sure about what the emotional struggle was. But like I said, we don’t necessarily have to know. I think the awareness is great. But just helping the body to integrate whatever trauma, you know, it experienced and help to relieve people of stuff they’ve been dealing with for a long time.

Victoria Volk: And for people that don’t know really the intricacies of bio field tuning or what it all involves? Can you just talk about from your expertise as a trainer? Right? Because you’re a trainer too.

Jillian Faldmo: Yep. Yeah. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: And I’m a student. I’m very much a student. So put your teacher hat on if you don’t mind and just share with people because there’s a new there’s some new contradiction or contraindications too. Right? There has been a revision

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. But it kind of it’s a little bit looser now. It’s more like we’ve gone from contraindications to cautions and guidance. And that’s really recognizing that each person is different. And we kind of we manifest our symptoms just based on our own life experiences. So there’s not really a one size fits all. Approacher or a black and white kind of thinking when it comes to, can I work with someone who’s got cancer? Can I work with someone who what’s another thing? Is on medication, like psychiatric medications and things like that. Where we do kind of I still practice extreme caution as pregnancy just because now we instead of there being one human involved, now there’s two. And so we just wanna make sure so biofuel tuning can allow your body to have like a cleaning response, meaning that this tension that we hold in our body can hold built up toxins as well just from like the food that we eat emotional toxicity, environmental toxicity. And so when we get that tension freed up, then that body has the opportunity to release that waste. And so people can have a headache, or digestion, upset, or kind of a number of things. They’re usually pretty mild, but they can happen. And so when we’re working with somebody who’s pregnant, we just we we don’t wanna create any kind of discomfort because it could affect the fetus as well. So anyway, I think you were asking how this were what was your question about bio field tuning specifically?

Victoria Volk: I don’t think you answered the question, but that that leads me too. Like, the hardest thing I I the hardest thing for me to explain to people is how does it work distance. Right? Because time knows no space or sequence or distance or anything like that. Right? So but that’s a really big concept to wrap our head around. And Yeah. I think the example I use is when, you know, when you’re thinking about someone and then that someone calls you, Yeah. It’s kinda like that. So

Jillian Faldmo: how do you hugs happen? Right? Yeah. So yeah. So it’s it is really hard to explain and wrap our heads around, but I kind of think too of, like, cell towers I don’t know a whole lot about, like, cell cellular service, but I was just thinking about it. And, you know, the the cell tower is putting out radio waves. And we can use our cell phones to contact anybody in the world. Right? With it, we’re not connect there’s no string connecting our phones or we’re not even in the same time zone. But we can connect with someone instantly. And so I think it’s kind of like that. Like, what we are working in waves and in waveforms and what we call it a plasma, right, which is it connects us all. It’s a medium that connects us all. Plasma, ether. And so it’s kinda like when we do this distant session, it’s like we’re dialing. I mean, we do literally dial someone’s number to connect with them. Over a distant session. But but the intention connects too, and we can connect with that person’s field and work with them at a distance, and they can receive that work in real time. So I don’t know if that confused people more than it needed to, but we just we think about, you know, just using things like cellphones. We don’t I don’t know how they work, but I use it every day. I rely on it. I trust it. And so we can do the same thing with this work too. And just so everybody knows with bio field tuning, we have a very firm boundary with this work that we always receive verbal permission to work with somebody because I just want everybody to know we’re not as practitioners going in there deciding we’re gonna work on this person now and they don’t even know. No way. We need their permission.

Victoria Volk: I have been asked that. Yeah. I have been asked, yeah, to do that. And I’m like, nope. I need permission. Even my own kids. Right? They, you know, I ask them and or they ask me, actually. And I have a lot of clients know too that Do you have a lot of clients know too that I love the analogy, by the way, on the tower, that’s I’m gonna use that. Do most

Jillian Faldmo: of your clients work with you remotely now? It’s like half and half right now. Yeah. So I I see clients in person twice a week at it. Amazing little wellness center here in town. You just love it. The owner’s amazing and she’s got great practitioners, including my husband who is a roping practitioner. Oh, what? Rolfing. Okay. So some people know what that is. Other people don’t. Rolfing is it’s like massage, but it’s working with the body’s connective tissue, and there’s a real focus on posture and movement and alignment. That’s the best way I can describe it. And usually, it’s done in a series of ten. So the first session is to release the breath and then you work he works from the feet all the way up to the head And it’s just great for people who have, you know, any of the things like postural issues, pain from, you know, not having good range of motion, things like that. I was born with my feet turned all the way in and my knees turned all the way out. So I’ve got these, like, fast shole torgens and my leg at all the way through my body and rolfing has really helped with that. So Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, so I two days a week at daybreak, wellness it’s called, and then I have remote sessions the other days of the week, and then I teach by Feltini.

Victoria Volk: Do you find that a lot of your clients that because a lot of my clients that started out of as as in person now have gone distance. But what I found too, like, a lot of them now, it’s like maintenance. Like, after you’ve had so many sessions and you’ve been a client for a while, you kinda you I think you it’s that you’re better able to tune in to yourself. Right?

Jillian Faldmo: Yes. Absolutely. Yeah. That’s what I tell people too. It’s like when you know, we usually recommend three sessions to start. And then after that, you know, if you wanna if you wanna keep going weekly, you totally can, but you start to kind of get a feel for when you’re going out of balance again. Mhmm. Because you have become like, it’s like a muscle that it’s an awareness that you build of what centered and grounded and neutral feel like. And so when you feel yourself kind of listing off to like, oh, now I’m I’m in this trigger state or I’m in this state of like anxiety or whatever it might be. For me, it’s I’ve my body feels compressed.
That’s when I know it’s time for me. That’s when I know it’s actually I’ve waited too long to get tuned. When I start to feel compressed and congested inside. Energetics.

Victoria Volk: Or it’s like your your chest, like, you’re just, like, tightness in your chest or you’re not, like, you know, breathing in people. Brand.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Mhmm. Yeah. That’s Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Kinda like that too. Like, you and that’s what happens. Right? When you’re kind of like this and you kinda bring your shoulders in and you can’t get a nice deep breath. Well, what is oxygen?
Right?

Jillian Faldmo: Right. It’s Right.

Victoria Volk: What feeds all of your cells in your body give, you know, the oxygen is what your body needs. Yeah. I just had to take a deep breath when you were talking about that. Me too. You know, it’s like plants. Right? What do they need? Sunlight, water, and oxygen. An oxygen.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Yeah. So how about you, Victoria? What what have you noticed the most about your, either transformation or the way your life has changed since doing biofuel tuning, but also Ricky, because they kind of happened pretty close together. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: They did. Yeah. Yeah. Energy work. Well, yeah, I think the biggest thing for me too has been being able to tune into myself. Just kind of what we were talking about, what happens with clients that happened with me. Right? I was better able to recognize, okay, this I need to step back or I need to break, people’s energy is just too much for me right now. It’s affecting my energy or I’m not making my energy a priority and maintaining that and cleaning it up. Right? Do I’m not cleaning my sweeping my side of the street and so other people’s stuff is affecting me. It’s been I’ve been it better able to recognize when that’s the case. I just feel more at peace more often than I feel And then when I’m not, I’m more I can quickly if I can shift more quickly too, you know. Right. Build that resilience. Like, you were talking. You were talking about building resilience. I think that’s what it helps us do as well. You know, and it’s in when once we feel the opposite side of suffering or grief or anger and resentment or physical pain, and once we feel the opposite of that, there’s the clarity. Right? Because there’s there’s a remembering that you can’t forget what that was like. But when you get a taste of what it’s what it can feel like the opposite of that, I want more of that. And so that’s where, you know, I feel like being open and curious, following the bread crumbs. If you’re listening to this and you’re like, this bio field tuning sounds really interesting or rakie or maybe you’ve heard about tuning forks or sound frequency a few times, maybe once. And now it’s like the third time, third time is a charm. I don’t know. It seems to be three times for me, but, you know, follow that curiosity. Go down the rabbit hole. It’s, you know, I think it’s coming to you for a reason. I think these things find us in perfect timing. You know, I can say I wish I would have discovered all of this stuff in my early twenties, but would I have been ready for it? I obviously wasn’t. Right? Because it didn’t come into my sphere of awareness. You know, I had to go through this really slow, arduous, like, long road, you know, is what it turned out to be. But I feel like I’m I don’t know if you’re into into human design at all.

Jillian Faldmo: I’ve just kinda skinned the surface of it.

Victoria Volk: Oh. So that’s a that could be a very deep rabbit hole. Yeah. That’s that’s a rabbit hole I’ve been going down for, like, about two years now.

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, okay.

Victoria Volk: Yep. And, you know, one thing that’s helped me is to realize, you know, just how how my energy speaks to me, really, and how it’s speaking to other people. In a way that I never realized because I would feel rejection a lot throughout my life. Mhmm. And what that what what that was, how I feel now, what that was, or how human design helped me reconcile that is they were feeling my energy. And I feel like once we start to pull back the layers of our own energy and our own lives and look at the stuff from the past where it can inform us it’s information, it’s data. Right? We can choose to look at that and shift our perspective and then help us to inform us for our future. Right? Because if we if I would have kept dragging my past experiences into the present moment and into my future. I would not be where I am today. Right? You know, so I had to look at that to recognize the impact it was having on me, but not just on me, that was the energy I was projecting out to others. Yeah. So

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. That’s that is a really good point of why at times it is important to reflect and become aware of those patterns so that you aren’t recreating the same thing over and over, especially if it’s not serving you.

Victoria Volk: And so what do you have to lose by trying biofuel tuning or reiki or any energy healing modality? Right? It’s what is it costing you not to? Really? What is that lack of awareness costing you.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. And I think it’s important to let people know just like the the cell phone analogy. Like, we don’t have to understand how it works for it to work. So if you think it sounds cool and intriguing, but you’re like, but, yeah, how does that even work? You only just come try it. Just, you know, with Victoria or me or anybody who, you know, someone that you trust, I think that’s the important thing. Right? Is is finding somebody that you trust. And that might take a few attempts to to find a practitioner that works for you.

Victoria Volk: Just like therapy. Right? You know, you’re not may not find the first one that you resonate with.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. I think it’s just so incredible to have support around you. And then we talked about that holism, right, holistic support. So what does that look like for you? Do you have the nutritional support? The physical support? The mental and emotional support? And do you have the spiritual and energetic support as well and making sure that we cover all of our bases so that we I mean, we are whole beings, but it’s when one of those areas isn’t supported that we start to lack wholeness in some regard.

Victoria Volk: That’s good.

Jillian Faldmo: That’s very true. Very true.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. But is one thing that you would I mean, that was a that was a great way to end this episode. But is there anything else that you would like to share either about you know, transforming emotion or challenging experiences throughout your life or grief using biofuel tuning? Is there anything that you would like to share with those listening about them.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Well, my favorite phrase and I didn’t make this up is you gotta feel it to heal it. So when it comes to emotion, we are designed, inherently designed to want to avoid it and or or resist it or react to it because it’s uncomfortable. Like as human beings, we are like our brains are designed to avoid pain, seek pleasure, and do it with the least amount of effort. So it’s an unconscious kind of response that we have when some kind of uncomfortable emotion comes up. We wanna either fix it or get rid of it, you know, those things. And so we have to use the part of our brain that has our highest and best interests in mind, our prefrontal cortex. That’s the amazing thing about being human. Is that we have this prefrontal cortex that we can intentionally decide that when discomfort comes up, that we’re gonna notice it, and we’re just gonna be with it. For I don’t know. Like, they say emotions last for ninety seconds. I don’t know how how true that it’s probably like an average. Right? But if we just decide to allow that emotion be in our body for even just ninety seconds, it can do wonders for our health. Because it’s when we’re resisting it or avoiding it, trying to get rid of it, it actually ends up building up in our bodies and in our tissues. And that’s where, you know, illness and disease comes into the picture. So that’s, you know, bio field tuning has taught me that for sure. To just when grief comes up or anxiety comes up, notice where it is in your body first.

Victoria Volk: Is it

Jillian Faldmo: in your chest, in your belly, in your throat? And then under not understand, but you know, tune into the frequency of it. Is it fast? Is it slow? Is it chaotic? Is it stuck? Is it open? And just breathe with it. And it’ll pass. And sometimes the emotions don’t pass in ninety seconds because we’ve either had them for a while or there’s something, you know, acutely going on. And it’s like we can we can go about our day and be present with emotion at the same time.

Victoria Volk: Are ruminating Right. On the emotion. And Right. Over yeah. Yeah. That brings up one key point about grief. Because I know you’re gonna share this on your podcast as well. And people have listened to mine. They’ve heard it a million times already, but bring it up because it’s going on your podcast too, is that reminds me of, you know, these behaviors that we resort to. We call them in grief recovery. We call them nerves. Short term energy relieving behaviors. Mhmm. And it could be things like alcohol or you know, substances that like drugs and pills, things like that, or shopping, gambling, pornography, workaholism can be a stirb. Exercise can be a disturb if, you know, you’re using it to avoid feeling. Right? It takes you out of that element of feeling when you’re It’s like you’re chasing this other high, right, as let’s say you’re a marathon runner. I’m not saying you’re running away from something in your life, but could you be? And that’s the curiosity I want to pose people with is, are you using this behavior whether it could be deemed as positive or negative, like running your exercise versus alcohol. Are you using that to feel better for a short period of time? Because, yeah, you will feel better for a short period of time, but you know, maybe some guilt and shame and other things come into play as a result. Well, that doesn’t feel very good. Well, so what do you do again? Oh, you resort back to that same behavior. It’s like this vicious cycle. Yeah. That’s where we have to recognize what’s happening within us is being We’re exhibiting that on the outside. Well, how is it showing up though? Is it showing up? Is it physical manifestation? Or is it showing up as a behavior? Yeah. Anger two can be a stirb, you know.

Jillian Faldmo: Right? Because it’s a release. It can be a release. Right? But maybe not used in an appropriate way.
Yeah.

Victoria Volk: One suggestion I just heard not that long ago was a screaming pillow. Have a pillow that you used to scream in Yep. For anger. That could be it. Well, I I added the part for anger because that’s what comes up for me. You know, that’s what I think of is you know, because how out, you know, you could positively like another way for me with anger too is, you know, moving weights, like lifting weights. It’s a great, like, you know, great, you know, pushing something, you know? Yeah.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Oh, my gosh. I love weight lifting. That’s me. That’s something that has just really helped me to get into my body more.
Because you have to especially with heavy lifting, like, you have to pay attention to how your feet are on the floor, to where your breath is, to what muscles you’re engaging. It’s been such a an amazing tool in the toolkit, weightlifting.

Victoria Volk: And, you know, like, I’m in my four days now, so it’s, like, to get this, like, have this aha, like, I don’t have to do anymore cardio. Like Yeah. Right? Don’t sign me up. I live five days a week. I’m like, yeah, bring it. I I absolutely fell in love with it. Fell in love with it. Yeah. Me too. What’s interesting too is I used to be a gym rat, like, in my early twenties. But I would also then I’d I’d be at the gym for, like, two hours, you know, doing cardio and stuff like that. But then I’d also be at the bar for, like, I’d shut down a bar too. So I was like, okay. It doesn’t really equate. Do they? You know, it was like one behavior after another. You know, that I was trying to just avoid Yeah. That it’s feeling.

Jillian Faldmo: Was the gym going to the gym in response to, like, guilt and shame about being at the bar or Probably like that. Like, cycle.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. It was a cycle. It was a cycle because I don’t think yeah. You know, come to think of it. Yeah. I think it probably was. You know, it made me feel better. Well, I’m doing this. I might be doing this later, but I’m doing this now.

Jillian Faldmo: Yep. Yep. Yep. It reminds me sometimes of when I have one too many cookies and I’m like, alright. Well, I think I should go for a walk now.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. And and it that’s a good question. Like, what’s motivating me? I think that’s the deeper thing. Like, what’s motivating me to do this?
Is it because I’m feeling guilt or shame around something else? Yeah. Right?

Jillian Faldmo: Or is or is it because I love myself and I want to, you know, honor my body and feel amazing. And that’s

Victoria Volk: a much better intention to go into it with. Right? Yes. And I think that was one of the things I was gonna bring up to was, like, even going into, like, an energy healing session with a client, like or someone just really wanting to sit with their own energy and tattoo into it is, what’s the intention? Intention is half of it.
Yes. That’s really half of what we do is setting an intention.

Jillian Faldmo: Totally. That’s so funny. And we were just having a conversation about that with Aileen I was just on a call with Aileen Mckusick and and Angela Kent, and we’re talking about intention in biofuel tuning sessions, and intention is different than having an agenda. Like an intention is something, let’s put this focus out there, or let’s put this thought out there, but then let it go. Right, with no kind of no expectation of what the outcome is going to be. Having an agenda would be having a very specific expectation of what the outcome will be. And trying to get there. And it’s it’s not done in the right kind of space. It’s not when we have an agenda, we’re not being curious, we’re not deeply listening, we’re not hearing what wants to happen when we have that intention. It’s like setting the focus and then letting it go and just seeing what presents and what arises.

Victoria Volk: And I don’t know if this is the case for you, but I I tend to because my son was like, you know, he’s in a he’s in college and he’s like, as he’s kind of a skeptic. And I’m I’m actually a true I’m a skeptic too. Like, I I have to try it and I have to, like, be proven

Jillian Faldmo: Yep.

Victoria Volk: Before I’ll, like, share it with somebody else or, like, I have to experience it first before I’ll share it with somebody else and you know, he just it’s, like, witcher here. It’s, like, some sort of voodoo, you know, like, do you have any idea what you’re bringing into the space when you’re doing this stuff? And I’m, like, yeah, I absolutely do because I have a I open every session with a prayer. I only asked for the highest for my highest good and for my the highest good of my client, you know. Yeah. Oh, okay. Well, that’s good to know. Then he was okay with it. But it’s like, again, that comes back to intention and and, you know, that we only want what’s for the highest good of our clients and also for ourselves if we’re, you know, working on ourselves. So

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so coming back to the the walk or the exercise or whatever, if we have if the intention is well, now I need to beat myself up because I just did that thing, and it’s not gonna be a very good walk. Very experienced. You’re probably not gonna get a lot out of it except for just more beating yourself up. But if you go in, you know, the intention is, I love myself. I love my body. I want I wanna provide my body with this opportunity to move. It’s gonna be a lot nicer.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. And it’s just like if we’re gonna have a difficult conversation with somebody, it’s what what is this has come up a lot in, you know, just in relationships. Right? For me, personally, lately, it’s what does the intention before I go to send that voice memo or the go before I go to send that text, like, what is the intention or what is the energy that I’m in doing that? And I think it’s important for us as practitioners too that before we come into a session, what is the energy that I’m in. Right? What what is my energy at right now before coming into this? Because just as we can feel the energy of our clients, they can feel ours too.

Jillian Faldmo: Yes. I don’t know if you’ve been experiencing this lately, but, you know, with the chaos of the world right now, which I try not to tune in too too much, but it’s palpable. You know, I can’t really feel it. My energy levels have been just a little bit lower. And so I’ve been noticing myself, like, at the beginning of the day, just be like, I don’t wanna see clients. I’m just doing this whole whiny thing. And then I’m like, no, Jill. No, no, no. Like, I kinda do this flip where I coach myself and I’m like, no, I chose this path. Like, I want to help these people. I love it. It’s just kinda like giving myself a little pep talk. I love doing this work and I’m not faking it. When I say it, but it’s just a matter of, like, kind of changing the narrative because I think it’s the chaos of what’s going on out there that’s really informing my thoughts on being, like, no. And whiny and, you know, all that.
So just kind of what’s the word I’m looking for?

Victoria Volk: Like, shifting the energy?

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Shifting it or overriding that and and coming into a more conscious and intentional place with how I wanna be in my own life. Because like you said, if I came into a session with clients feeling it. No. No. No. I’m at. It’s so they’re not gonna come back. I wouldn’t. If I were them,

Victoria Volk: Yeah. Or how much of the session is influenced being influenced by, like, how much of it or is it your energy that’s getting in the way, you know? Right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Jillian Faldmo: Good stuff. Is there anything else you wanna share about your journey before we disconnect?

Victoria Volk: I just want people who practitioners because I think it’s mostly practitioners, you know, people in the energy healing work modalities that listen to your podcast, I imagine. And I just want people listening to it’s so important for us as healers to heal ourselves first. And I think we can only sit with others in their lowest energy. Right? Because they’re coming to us low energy.
They need their I don’t wanna say it. How does Aileen say it?

Jillian Faldmo: That she talks about voltage. So They’re battery charged.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. Yeah. They’re coming to us to get their voltage raised. Right? And if we’re not raising our own voltage.
How can we expect to sit with them? And are we gonna match you know, like attracts like. Right? So a session can either go one way or the other. It’s either gonna either they’re gonna match hours or we’re gonna match theirs.
Yeah. Although at the same time, I get energized by sessions too. So

Jillian Faldmo: well, I think part of that it it’s I think part of that is the sound, but I wonder if part of that and I haven’t thought about this before, so this is just like off the cuff. But I wonder if part of that feeling energized as a practitioner at this at this session is because we have been so intentional with our how we’re using our energy. Like we like as bio field tuning practitioners, we are trained that when we’re in sessions to really bring our energy our own energy in and have it flowing through our central channel. And we we intentionally connect to the earth and to the sun. We help the client do that too.
So I’m wondering if it’s that that energizes us is because we, on some level, take our power back because we’re being so conscious about how we’re using that energy and how we’re we’re directing our own energy. When we’re, like, out in the, you know, just, you know, out in the world and not being intentional with that, I think it’s so easy for us to leak some energy and light and just Or be a sponge. Or be a sponge. Right? Yeah.
Yeah. Take on a lot, which is draining.

Victoria Volk: I guess, what have you found if you’re having a have you ever canceled the session? If you’re having a really difficult day or, you know, challenging not feel Well, of course, if you’re not feeling well, you know, it’s

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Definitely. Like, you know, I’ve I’ve had, you know, bouts of COVID or the flu and I will cancel for sure. What I’ve learned too is that if I’m feeling physically unwell to just don’t overthink it, don’t try and wait till the very just cancel everything that day and give yourself the opportunity to rest so that you bounce back. Because I’ve done it before. I have just dragged it out, just canceled one client, and then the next, it, like, over time, just think maybe I’ll feel better. Maybe I’ll feel better. And it just prolonged, I think, the illness. But yeah, emotionally, like, you know, I remember my husband and I getting into a big fight about something. It was probably really dumb, but we were both emotionally upset. And I think when you fight with your spouse, it’s it’s just really upsetting and I couldn’t quite come to neutral. So in those instances, I’ll cancel. But if I’m just feeling like a little off usually a sessional. Help me get back back to the right spot. How about you?
I’ve actually

Victoria Volk: I have not been sick since twenty twenty two. Wow.

Jillian Faldmo: How did you

Victoria Volk: COVID. I had COVID. And but it was actually my son had really traumatic accident. It’s changed his life, but he’s good now. But that’s when I got COVID. It was like my system was just as complete overload. I had a kink or sore that was like the size of Texas in my it was that was horrible. It was so stressful. No wonder I got COVID.

Jillian Faldmo: Wow.

Victoria Volk: But Yeah. I haven’t had it since, and I, you know, flu, colds. Nothing. It’s like

Jillian Faldmo: Wow.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. I don’t know. I knock on wood. Like I said,

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: But I really do contribute the work that I do to, you know, to that. Like and recognizing when I need to rest before it gets to that point, I think, where I do get sick, you know?

Jillian Faldmo: Right.

Victoria Volk: And I’ve really looked at my schedule. This is great for practitioners listening to. It’s like, I’m trying to find ways that I can work with my energy because I know that I need more rest than some human design has helped me recognize that. Like, I and even as a kid, like, I needed a lot more sleep. And even as an adult now, I need more rest than maybe some other people. And so working with that in understanding that about myself, well, how can I make that work with my life in because I, you know, I have a day job? I have three kids. One’s in college. One’s gonna be going to college. I have I’m a spouse.
I do my healing work. I have my podcast. Like, I have a lot of irons in the fire. Right?

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: It’s like, how do I manage it all? Well, I I think where I started was looking at my energy. And what do I what am I choosing to put my energy toward? What are my priorities, and then looking at my schedule. And I only do one energy healing session per day.
That’s it.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: That’s it. Typically, I only do one podcast recording per day. That’s it. Yeah. Like, I really limit what I do.
And it’s like, well, how do I need

Jillian Faldmo: to be able to do a lot? Because, you know, how

Victoria Volk: to to sparse it out. And so now I’m looking at how can I help more people in a shorter amount of time or in a same amount of time? And so that’s I’m working on something right now to do that with energy work that works around my life and my energy so that I can show up and really come to my this work with more play and creativity. And so that’s kind of that’s what I’m working on right now. So I love that.

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, I’m excited to hear more about that. What is your human design? Oh, go ahead.

Victoria Volk: I’m a four six emotional manifesto.

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, see, I don’t know. The the I know I’m a manifesting generator, but I don’t know the numbers or There might be something about a sacral in there. Does that make sense?

Victoria Volk: Okay. You’re a sacral authority probably then. Yeah. And Yep. So, like, for me, I’m an emotional authority, so I have to ride before making decisions and stuff. I have to ride the emotional wave, which has been a huge, huge game changer in my life. I need to be in a neutral place before I make a decision. I can’t make a decision on an emotional high, and I can’t make a decision. I shouldn’t. Making decision on emotional low.

Jillian Faldmo: Mhmm.

Victoria Volk: And that’s really helped me. Meaning for business, it’s huge. That’s a huge. Just even knowing your authority alone is a game changer, especially if you own a business.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: And if you’re in relationships, which most of the star. So

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Because where there’s conflict, right, is when let’s say now sacral and spleenek are kinda similar in a way. Sacral, it’s like your body speaks. It’s it’s either an uh-huh or a no. Yeah. And we’re splenic. It’s like instant and it’s your body’s not gonna tell you more than once. But sacral is, like, if I ask you a question in you tune in, like, how does that feel in your body? Is that a yes or no? Like, do you wanna go out to dinner tonight?

Jillian Faldmo: No. Oh, I was like Yes.

Victoria Volk: Feeling okay. So you feel like, yes. Let’s go. Let’s do this. That’s your sacral. Whereas if you said, if you if you’re, like, no. In your body, like Yeah. But you said yes. Yeah. That is not you’re not You’re not You’re

Jillian Faldmo: no kidding.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. Yep.

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, so that’s really cool because that affirms what I was saying earlier about how biophilled tuning has helped me is to know my yes and my no in my body. Bingo Yep. And ingest it.

Victoria Volk: Yes. And so how it’s helped me as a manifesto, emotional manifesto is Okay. Recognizing the emotion and what that emotion feels like in my body? You know? So it’s like, I’ll have this feeling come up. They actually just happened not that long ago. I was just I got I don’t know. It’s just like this overwhelming, like, sadness. Just came over me and I even said to my daughter, I was like, we’re driving somewhere. I’m like, I don’t know.
I just feel like the sadness. Just like about what? I’m like, I don’t even know. And it’s like, okay. Well, That wasn’t even mine. I was thinking about my son, but I think it was that wasn’t even my sadness. I was feeling something from him. Mhmm.

Jillian Faldmo: You know

Victoria Volk: what I mean? Yeah. So it’s it’s even recognizing, like, what is mine and what isn’t. That’s where, you know, energy work and biofuel tuning has helped me kinda tune into too.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. So helpful. Do you do within the petrochem human design, like, for your clients? Or is that more a tool for you?

Victoria Volk: That’s still a playground for me. Mhmm. So, like, with my grief clients, for sure, I will ask them their details because you need your date of birth, your time of birth, and your place of birth. And it really does matter your time of birth because that can change your gates and channels of your human design. And so and there’s guidance. I think if you go there’s I mean, just Google it. Like, if you don’t know your time of birth, there’s guidance on what to do with that. But if you can find it, that’s important to know, not to guess on that. But, yeah, with my grief clients, I do I have had a few energy clients that felt, you know, when I was especially first kind of dabbling into it, I would ask them and actually one in particular I can think of right now and she was a projector and I’m like, that makes so much sense. And so I was kinda helping kind of coaching her around her energy as a projector because projectors need like, manifestors, projectors need a lot of alone time Mhmm. And need time to be with themselves and can feel very drained if they’re peeling a lot. So and in order to tune into themselves, manifestors and projectors, that’s where there are a lot of like, we need that time alone. To be introspective and reflective. And that’s how we come that’s how we sat and re reset and recharge.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. I could see that being so helpful for somebody who’s in their grief. Like, you know what? It’s acute. Knowing that about them because I think it’s I’m I think in some cultures anyway, it’s like surround the person who’s grieving.
Like, be with them. Don’t leave them alone. But if someone maybe who’s in that culture knows that about themselves that they they will actually do a little bit better having some alone time than being able to ask ask for that or, you know, tell people like I need some alone time.

Victoria Volk: Well, and so one of the other aspects of grief recovery that I’ve incorporated into my grief work is called umap, and that’s actually uses four different assessments, including Clifton strengths. You get your top five strengths and then we glean your top ten values and your preferred skills, at least preferred skills and then your personality and how how you’re wired. That’s actually also another element that I bring into the work that I do because when your values are being dishonored by somebody else such as, let’s say, honesty in your relationship with somebody and they’re not being honest with you or they flat out did lie to you and they told you they lied to, that’s not honesty is a reciprocal value. So if and you can dishonor your own values. Let’s say growth, for example, because your podcast is about growing a practice and, you know, if I’m growth is one of my values.
So if I’m growing and evolving and, like, looking into personal development, but my spouse isn’t, and that’s not and we’re kinda growing at different paces or different you know, that can create some friction or that can create some

Jillian Faldmo: totally

Victoria Volk: disconnection and things like that. So you know, but we I don’t know where I was going with that. But when it comes to then human design, depending on what your gates and channels are and your authorities. So take authority, for example, too, like, let’s say, you are a sacral, and I’m an emotional, and we’re in a relationship. Or your spouse is the opposite of you, you’re gonna have an answer like that, or a spleenek will, for sure.
Mhmm. I’m not. I might take two or three days or even two to three weeks to come to a decision. So if it’s a decision, like, we should we move, I’m gonna need to ride my emotional wave, whereas, you know, that can create conflict.

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, totally. I could see that. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. So

Jillian Faldmo: that’s good to know.

Victoria Volk: All of these tools like, human design or u map can reveal to us where the conflict is. Yeah. But then when you know what the conflict is or what the root of it is, then you know what to work on. Right? Yeah.
Yeah.

Jillian Faldmo: It’s not some big mystery. Yeah. Like, can’t we agree on something? Or why can’t we come to a decision together? So, like, why is this

Victoria Volk: always an issue? Why is this always coming up? Yeah. Yeah. There’s tools out there that can help you find that figure that out.
And especially, like, if you’re in business for yourself, and you’re also you’re a solo entrepreneur, you know, do you need a coach? Sometimes you don’t. Sometimes the answer is just knowing yourself better. Right? You know? Not same. Yeah. But I’ve hired coaches. So, I mean, I’m not can you know, yeah, sometimes you need a coach because you can’t see the label from inside the jar either, you know.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. But Right. You don’t always need one. Like, it just times when you do and times where you can learn how you best make decisions and learn about your emotions? Yeah. And go from there. I know that we’re Oh, wow. It’s totally okay. I wanted you to Good. I wanted you to talk a little bit more about your you have a grief or you said grief recovery program?

Victoria Volk: Yeah. So I okay. It’s called do grief differently. And it’s twelve weeks one on one, and I do that virtually. And then I can also do groups in person or online as well. But it’s yeah. That’s my, like, flagship offering for my grief work. And it includes grief recovery method, which is you work through two really difficult relationships. They can be someone with someone living or someone who has passed and you learn your u map. So we start with u map. We go into grief recovery and then we end with u map. So it’s kind of like this u map helps you better understand where there might be grief that you didn’t realize. Yeah. And we end with it because after you’ve really released a lot of this emotional stuff, it’s like, okay. Well, what’s next?

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. You

Victoria Volk: know? So that’s cool.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. I love that. I love that. And I love the way that I’ve listened to your podcast and the way that you talk about grief is let’s talk about grief like we talk about the weather. Mhmm.

Victoria Volk: That’s so good. Let’s normalize it.

Jillian Faldmo: And I’ll just add all emotions to that because Grief is one and then, oh my gosh, there’s just so many that that aren’t talked about because I think it’s definitely changing, but in the past, it’s like you’re supposed to be happy all the time.

Victoria Volk: Well, an anger is bad, you know.

Jillian Faldmo: An anger is bad. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: That was the belief that I was, you know, I was around a lot of anger. And so I stuffed my own anger because I saw the impact it had. Not only on me, but in the household. Right? And so when you stuff anger, it’s it’s like poison that you take. We say that resentment is poison you take, hoping the other person dies. Right. But anger is like a poison too.

Jillian Faldmo: Wow. Yep. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: And it’s not like, it’s it’s anger stuff down becomes the poison. Right? But Yeah. Anger can actually be really great fuel, totally for change and transformation, which is what it was for me.

Jillian Faldmo: I started to look at what all the emotions, all the uncomfortable emotions are trying to tell us. And they all have an important role Shame included. I know a lot of people are like, no. Shame is not useful and they’re actually it is useful. It’s you know, it helps us to stay in integrity and to like I was talking to Aileen today. She talked about Shame and she was like, if I didn’t have shame, then if my kitchen were a mess and my whole house were a mess and I was just being a slob and, like, I wouldn’t care about it, but, like, if somebody walked in, I and I was like, oh my gosh. What am I doing? You know, it just it keeps us you know, in check. Yeah. But we don’t wanna overindulge in it.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. And that brings up a good question. I’ll ask because people listening who listen to my podcast, they’ll People who listen to yours already know this, but people who listen to mine may not. Can you just talk a little bit about the emotions and where we tend to find them in the body?

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, yeah. So just like we have an anatomy in our body. Right? We all have a, you know, our hearts are all in the same place, you know, maybe give or take a centimeter or millimeter or two. Grains are all in the same place. We also have an emotional anatomy that’s stored within our bio field. And so this was discovered by Aileen McCusick, who we’ve been talking about. She’s the founder of bio field tuning. She found that we door, like, sadness, grief, and loss over to the left of the shoulder, left side of the heart chakra. We store saying yes when we mean no or resentment over on the right side of the heart chakra. We store a pattern of busyness, overdoing, overthinking, off the right side of the hip, frustration and disappointment off the left side of the hip, as well as unmet needs. And we really I won’t go into the full map here, but we’re we can map all the way from the feet to the head where certain emotions are stored. And so if those of you who are listening, if you have a body part that’s been ailing you for some time, it may be emotional. It probably is. There’s probably some emotional significance there. And so if you’re a listener of Victoria’s, she she can surely guide you there. If you wanna reach out to her, if you have, you know, a shoulder that’s been bothering you for a a long time. A lot of us have right shoulder issues, caretakers do, so moms, those who are in the caring profession because that’s the the shoulder of our over caretaking for others emotional needs and putting other people first. Instead of ourselves. This is a really common one. Wanted to point that out. Lot of right hip stuff in the world too. The right hip busyness, overdoing, overthinking. Gotta stay busy, to stay productive, to be worthy. So right hip could be indicative of that. Yeah. I think I already talked about the right hip, but it that’s a really common one. Really, really common. A lot of hip replacements are done in the right hip. In our culture.

Victoria Volk: And often too, I have found too, like, with clients. Like, if they are having, like, headaches on the left side of their head, the right hip is yeah.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. The left side of the head is worrying about the future. Yeah. Yeah. Yep.
And they they go together. Right? Worrying about the future, overthinking, staying busy, staying productive. Mhmm. Yeah.
You

Victoria Volk: know, it that was mind blowing to me when

Jillian Faldmo: I first learned about the anatomy app and Yeah. It’s yeah. It’s fun to just carry around like a little mini version of the map and, you know, I I travel a lot, you know, teaching bio field tuning and my whole family lives on the East Coast, so we’re out there at least once a year. But, you know, strike up a conversation in an Uber or on a plane and my left elbow or whatever and just pull out the math. You know, could it be related to this?
Like what?

Victoria Volk: Yep. I actually have it in my Google Drive. So

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, nice. Yeah. There you go.

Victoria Volk: This is there.

Jillian Faldmo: Yep. Hit hit pull it up on your phone or tab with it. Yeah. Nice.

Victoria Volk: Well, this has been so fun, and I hope that your listeners Other practitioners out there have learned a little bit about grief and and how it can show up in your practice because actually I’ve had several of people come to me for energy work and they end up doing the grief work with me.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. It makes

Victoria Volk: a lot of sense. You know, because, you know, oh, I guess I oh, I haven’t thought about that in a long time or it brings up stuff. You know, sessions and energy where it can bring up some stuff. And so I’ve I’ve often found that you know, the grief work kind of follows the energy work sometimes. Or it can go the opposite too. Like, people that have worked with me and the grief work, like, oh, I just you know, I just wanna, like, up level my you know, I’ve done all this emotional stuff and done all this work. Now, let’s brace my voltage. Right? So it kinda goes hand in hand and and I know my listeners heard from you in a way that, you know, you explain it differently than I do and probably have better than I did because I love the whole cell tower analogy. So thank you for that.

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, yeah. You’re welcome. Yeah. And I guess I’ll just add one. I know we’re trying to, like, wrap this up, but I I can’t stop, like, talking and coming in to talk about. But kind of how I see, like, grief connected with the work that we do in in energy work and biofuel tuning is when we have these experiences that maybe aren’t necessarily, like, someone passing away, but even the things like, you know, how I mentioned in the beginning of the episode where there’s, like, this lack of connection that all of a sudden I’m sensing. These moments in time where we experience stress, we’re also experiencing some sort of soul loss as well. It feels like, like, that’s it. When we experience stress, we emit light particles, we emit biofotons, and so those those little biophotons that are supposed to be, you know, running through our center, and they’re now kind of outside of our body. Second, our field, they’re still with us, but they’re just kind of orbiting around our field. Rather than being centered. So that can be, you know, just these experiences we have that we don’t maybe we wouldn’t consider them a loss. I mean, essentially, that is what they they are. It’s it’s a loss of light and I think it’s when we return that light. We that’s the process of biofuel tuning is is locating that light in the field and bringing it back to the body. That’s when we realized, like, oh, like, now I feel at home, like or now I feel whole again. So just something else to kinda consider when it comes to grief and loss is it’s I like you always talk about, it’s not it doesn’t have to be this big tragic loss, but it’s just sometimes these little moments in time where we lose parts of our self. And if we do that frequently and often, you know, I’m I’m sure grief would absolutely present.

Victoria Volk: It’s like, that was so good. It’s like dying from a thousand paper cuts, you know. Yeah. And, you know, And, really, I’ll share with your listeners too. I mean, the definition of grief is the loss of hopes, dreams, and expectations.
Mhmm. And anything that you wish would have been or could be different, better, or more.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. That makes sense. Totally amazing. Yeah. It’s a lot of things.
So that’s why processing grief is so important because it it it’s pervasive, really.

Victoria Volk: Yeah? Yeah.

Jillian Faldmo: And I’m so glad you’re doing this work, Victoria. That’s awesome.

Victoria Volk: Well, and thank you for teaching and expanding bio field tuning. I’m glad it found I’m so thankful it came into my awareness. I’m actually the one forty four. And then when I first heard it, I was like, what was it? Yeah. The one forty four. Yeah. Yeah. That’s the emotional one. Yeah. I like, when I first heard that, I was like, But it’s like it’s the it’s like the one that when that comes up and I don’t I don’t I don’t know if you do this, but I don’t choose the fork for my sessions.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: I let my pendulum do that.

Jillian Faldmo: Mhmm. Okay. Yep.

Victoria Volk: And it never fails. The one forty four is only after they’ve had several sessions with me. Does that one come up? Or they’ve done a lot of energy healing work before coming to

Jillian Faldmo: me? Mhmm.

Victoria Volk: And so Yeah. It’s that’s been a fascinating connection for me to draw with that fork. It’s one of my and maybe it you know, it’s who I draw to me. Right? Because of the grief stuff that could be. Mhmm. But, yeah, that’s that’s often the go to for me and my work.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. I love that work. I call it my my bestie. But I hated it when I first got it. I was like, what is wrong with this fork?
It sounds terrible. And then I just kept using it. And now I was like, oh my gosh. I it’s that’s why I’m I only work with the three forks now. I think we were talking about that before. We started recording, but and biofuel tuning, there’s like a set of well, it keeps getting bigger, but it was just a set of five, including the two weighted forks, the one seventy four, five twenty eight, four seventeen hertz. And then we added this one forty four, and it was just I was just using the one one forty four and one seventy four. And now I use the I’ve added the two twenty two. But I have a whole sulfageo set on its way to me. Oh my god. I’m so excited. Yeah. Let’s see how I I had to order an extra carrying case because I’m I’m gonna run out of room.

Victoria Volk: I find too that I’m using the weighted forks a lot on the body as well, you know, when you know, sometimes that just comes up to be to be used. So Yeah. I I I don’t know. People listening, like, I love my pendulum. Like, the pendulum is is my b f f in sessions. I I feel like it’s not my energy then. You know, getting in the way or it’s, like, I’m not making the decision. Like, my clients’ energy is guiding the session. I feel like Yeah. When I let the pendulum, you know, when I yeah.
I don’t know. That’s a nice way

Jillian Faldmo: to approach your session because it’s like if you don’t have to think about anything and you just follow, it just it saves you energy and it’s just such a much enjoyable more enjoyable session because there’s like no need to perform. Yeah. You know, a lot of practitioners can get kinda stuck in, like, needing to perform. And that’s not what it’s about. Just it’s about listening.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. And I think that’s I I think that’s where especially when I was first new, like, you you feel like you have to do it this certain way and it’s this prescribed way.

Jillian Faldmo: Mhmm.

Victoria Volk: And I was just, like, I don’t know, with that with the pendulum safe, that’s the one I should use. And, you know, I even, like, drawing a card for somebody. Like, I use Oracle cards and I’ll draw a card for somebody. I thought, pendulum is deciding what deck When I draw a card for myself, I’m yeah. It’s a pendulum. So Yeah. Nice. And not using your pendulum. Play with it a little bit more. Yeah. You know, if you’re listening to this.

Jillian Faldmo: Good stuff.

Victoria Volk: Yeah.

Jillian Faldmo: Well, thank you so much, Victoria. This is lovely.

Victoria Volk: Thank you. I look forward to sharing this on my podcast. They can people can learn more in-depth about bio field tuning and energy and all of that because I’m trying to bring more of that into my podcast too because it is it it is how do you wanna say it? Like, emotions involve our bodies. Right?
It’s it’s an energetic experience. And so I think there’s the two married together is Yeah.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Emotions are electromagnetic. And so energy work is working on that spectrum. So even I mean, even just feeling your own emotion, even just allowing your own emotion is energy work. So good job.

Victoria Volk: That’s true. Well, thank you so much for having me on your podcast, and thank you for being on mine. And just thank you for this opportunity. I’m glad we did this.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. Thank you. It’s it’s just always so good for my audience to hear from other practitioners who are who were doing the work and the world and what their journey has been and what you know, their your perspective has been on the work, and it’s been great to hear from you. So thanks, Victoria.

Victoria Volk: Where can people find you if they wanna reach out to you?

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, yes. Good question. You can find me at gillianfaldmo dot com. And you? Victor, well, where aren’t you on social?

Victoria Volk: Are you in social?

Jillian Faldmo: Oh, I I am on social. I’m not the most active but you can find me there, jillian falsmo dot coaching on Instagram and then Facebook. I think it’s just jillian falsmo. But I’m all about I’m all about teaching people marketing without killing themselves on social media.

Victoria Volk: My favorite either. I have a VA and gosh. If I when I got a VA that was, yeah, for your listeners too on, you know, building your practice and stuff. You know, it’s hire that stuff out. Like, you don’t have to do everything.

Jillian Faldmo: Yeah. You know? Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. I am at the unleash chart dot com. The unleash chart dot com. My website and linked to my podcast grieving voices is on there. And a book that I wrote, I mentioned, is on there, and all my socials, you’ll find me there, are the unleashed Heart on Instagram and the unleashed Heart LLC on Facebook.
And then I’m on LinkedIn too, but Yeah. All the links are on my website though.

Jillian Faldmo: Awesome. Yeah. Go check out Victoria’s podcast, the unleashed heart. It’s awesome.

Victoria Volk: Angelic. Because if you wanna learn more about energy work Yep.

Jillian Faldmo: Awesome. Alright, everybody. Thanks for being with us. We appreciate you.

Victoria Volk: Much love.

Ep 221 Christopher Cochran | What’s Good About Today?: A Father’s Mission To Honor His Son’s Legacy

 

SHOW NOTES SUMMARY:

In this heartfelt episode of Grieving Voices, Chris Cochran shares the inspiring legacy of his late son Christian, who faced terminal cancer with remarkable positivity and resilience. Despite his illness, Christian lived life to its fullest up until his untimely death at the young age of 23—all while asking, “What’s good about today?”

Christian’s spirit continues to inspire through Chris’s nonprofit, What’s Good About Today?, and the book that bears the same name. Today’s episode highlights how Chris and his wife navigated the highs and lows of working diligently to get Christian the best possible care while supporting their other children. They then grappled with the profound loss of Christian, emphasizing patience, love, and being present as crucial elements in healing.

Key takeaways include acknowledging that each person’s experience of grief is unique; fostering an environment rich in understanding and compassion can aid healing amidst life’s unpredictability. Chris’s story also underscores a shift from material pursuits toward deeper spiritual connections post-loss—focusing on empathy over goals.

Chris recounts how he’s felt Christian’s presence following his death and how the ongoing relationship with his son has supported his healing.

This conversation is a powerful reminder that even amid tragedy, there is potential for enduring hope through community support, and living purposefully driven lives filled with kindness ensures loved ones’ legacies endure.

RESOURCES:

CONNECT:

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If you are struggling with grief due to any of the 40+ losses, free resources are available HERE.

CONNECT WITH VICTORIA: 

Embracing Positivity and Resilience in the Face of Grief

In a poignant episode of Grieving Voices, Chris Cochran shares an inspiring narrative about his late son, Christian. Through this heartfelt discussion, we uncover invaluable lessons on resilience, positivity, and the enduring power of love amidst profound loss.

A Legacy Built on Positivity

Christian Cochran’s story is one that resonates deeply with anyone who has faced adversity. Diagnosed with terminal cancer at a young age, Christian chose to focus not on what was lost but rather on “What’s good about today?” This simple yet powerful question became a guiding mantra for him—and later inspired both his father’s nonprofit and book under the same title.

Despite battling cholangiocarcinoma—a rare form of liver cancer—Christian maintained an unwavering zest for life. He excelled academically, graduating magna cum laude while nurturing various artistic talents. His journey serves as a testament to living fully even when time feels limited.

Chris describes how he and his wife navigated their grief after losing Christian by seeking therapy and leaning into each other for support while caring for their two other children who were also profoundly affected by this loss. Their experience highlights the importance of acknowledging individual grieving processes within families—a reminder that patience, empathy, and presence are crucial during such challenging times.

Through candid conversations like those featured in Grieving Voices, listeners gain insight into coping mechanisms necessary when dealing with familial grief dynamics; understanding compassionately fosters stronger bonds amid life’s unpredictability.

Inspiring Change Beyond Loss

The ripple effect left behind by individuals like Christian extends far beyond immediate family circles—it inspires communities toward purposeful pursuits aligned more closely with personal values than societal expectations alone might dictate otherwise! Friends influenced positively have embarked upon careers centered around helping others due largely because they witnessed firsthand how someone facing immense challenges could still embody hopefulness every single day despite everything else happening simultaneously around them too!

For Chris himself? Sharing stories publicly through speaking engagements offers healing opportunities alongside connecting meaningfully amongst fellow grievers experiencing similar emotions firsthand themselves perhaps unexpectedly so initially until realizing newfound camaraderie exists naturally between all parties involved ultimately leading everyone collectively forward together unitedly towards brighter futures ahead regardless past tragedies endured previously now finally being processed constructively instead destructively anymore thankfully indeed…

Episode Transcription:

Victoria Volk: Hey, hey, hey, thank you for tuning in to grieving voices. Today, my guest is Chris Cochran. He is a father, husband, and founder of Blue Chip Solutions, inspired by his son, Christians, enduring positivity, Chris authored what’s good about today to share a message of resilience and gratitude. Professionally, he has over three decades of experience and leadership roles across various industries and serves on the Board of Coeptis Therapeutics. Through his nonprofit, also named what’s good about today, Chris is committed to spreading kindness and hope. I hope I said that right, coeptis Therapeutics. Is that correct?

Christopher Cochran: That’s right. Yeah. Great. Much bigger that.

Victoria Volk: I am on a roll, and it’s on Tuesday. So thank you so much for being here. And I before we hopped on, I was actually checking out it’s your son’s the website is christian cochran dot org. Correct?

Christopher Cochran: Correct. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: And I was reading a little bit about how that the backstory of why that got started, but I will actually leave that to you to share with our listeners why what’s good about today came to be?

Christopher Cochran: I lost my son to cancer, terminal cancer in two thousand and twenty one. Christian was diagnosed at the age of twenty to with something called cholangiocarcinoma. He just graduated college. He was everything was going swimmingly. Everything’s been going well. Obviously, he’s a family and, you know, sort of back story to this is, you know, I’m I’m married to my high school sweetheart. We’ve been together since I was fifteen years old. So our dream has always been to build a family together. And you know, we knew early on, we wanted to name our son Christian because the the name had so much importance. Right? Christian, it means what it is. We are Christians and we knew he was destined for something very important in this world and he didn’t he didn’t fail us on that because, you know, even as a young age, he showed this incredible form of empathy and just, you know, understood how life really worked even at a young age. He had great compassion and kindness whether it was at Christmas time, she wanted to give his his gifts away to his friends. I mean, whether it was just we used to refer to him as mister Comfort as a child because he had a way of comforting us when we were not feeling well or not doing doing well. So he he just had this incredible knack. And that kinda carried all the way through his life as a teenager. You know, I always think he kids as being teenagers. They’re horrible. And their Christian was fantastic. He was just a kind and gentle soul to everyone.
Giving of his time, his love, always said he loved you. And then, you know, Christian, very talented by the way, but his biggest talents, of course, were his kindness. Christian went to college, he graduated Magna Kamblad from from college, from the Honors College here in Pennsylvania. And, you know, when he got home, he started to experience some back pain, we took him to doctors, it seemed to be, you know, he was healthy. You know, everything about him was healthy. And he got physical therapy in his back, but this didn’t seem to change. But as it got, you know, in the summer months of two thousand twenty, his pain became overwhelming and so went and course, we had blood tests and ultimately he had a CT scan to be safe. And I remember them saying, hey, they found a lesion, a scar on his liver. And of course, you know as a parent, you’re like, okay, that’s not so bad. We can, you know, you know, that could have been from birth or whatever, and then they said you need to go to Hillman Cancer Institute.
And I remember thinking, oh, no. What does that mean? I kept reassuring Christians. Okay. Now Christian through this whole thing is, It’s okay. I’m not worried about it that. You know, it’s still going to be okay. Reassure this whole family. But we went to the hospital, and this is during COVID, so I can only go with Christian. And I’ll never forget, you know, just before they walked in and telling Christian, it’s gonna be fine. You know, they were gonna sort of talk to us. Five coats walked in the door lapcoats with the mask, and I could I could read their eyes in that instant what they were about to deliver to us that I knew was gonna be life changing for Christian, life changing for his family and his friends, and ultimately they told Christian that he had a great fruit sized tumor on his liver and that this was cancer. And that it was likely terminal. At the time, we weren’t fully positive, but I think Christian knew because he asked the doctors immediately. And I money started to shake. I I started to go black. Christian put his hand on my shoulder. He looked me in the eye. He said, dad, don’t worry. Everything’s gonna be okay. Once again, comforting me in the worst of moments for him. And he asked him how long did he have to live? And he he they when they answer that question rightly so, I assume. But I knew and I think Christian knew this is what was gonna happen. Of course, we left, had to go home, had to tell his mother, what had transpired. He had to be there with us. And I remember my wife and I telling Christian that says we’re we’re obviously in shock and sad and just saying Christian, we’re so sorry that you have to go through this. You know, what this has happened to you. And I remember Christian saying, dad, mom, don’t you know, it’s okay. I would rather this happen than me than anyone else. This is my burden to take. And, you know, again, he just showed us his his way of comforting us. I can tell you that Christian not a single time from the moment he got diagnosed. To the moment he took his last breath on September first of twenty twenty one about a year later, did he ever complain? He never said, why me? He said, dad, how could this happen to me? He did the opposite. He would say, what’s good about today? And so it was his way of showing us that even in the worst of moments, in the in the most tragic of circumstances that you can truly find goodness in moments. And so he used to remind us of that. He used to say what’s good about today when we would cry and we’d be upset. We’d try not to cry, of course. Remain very hopeful. But we knew the circumstances. You know, Christian had a less than one percent chance of life even to get the five years. And with cholangio carcinoma, which is by layman’s terms called Biodec Cancer. It’s mostly seen in old people, Southeast Asia. It’s not something you find for a kid in North Pittsburgh, you know. And he so he we knew the I knew ultimately what was going to happen here. And and in young people in particular who get this, when they get it, it’s very rare.
They don’t live past six months. So, you know, we knew we were up against the fight. And so the so to to answer your question, it’s a long story to get to it, but the point being is that Christian used what’s good about today to remind us of the beauty that you can find every day even in the the most difficult of moments. And that’s what I try to do is to, you know, remember that constantly so that I can put that out into the world, remind people that, hey, here’s a kid who had everything going for him. I tell you he had everything going for him in this life.
But he was handed the worst worst thing you could ever ask for. And he turned it completely around and he thrived. He he got a job. Who goes and gets a job? With a major company because we had to stay in turn. He he took a job for four months. They hired him. He was honest when he said, look, I’m not gonna be around in the year. Just so you know. And they were like, it’s okay. You know? God bless them for doing that. But he wanted to show us and guide us that his life hadn’t stopped. And he wasn’t going to stop showing his other his brother and his sister that and us, that he wasn’t gonna stop. He was gonna continue to move forward. He he made music. He did podcast. Which are still out there and they’re very good. And he just he just had that way about him and he laughed and he he he always was making you laugh and so he was just an extraordinary human being. And I just wanna help in you know, I’m inspired by Christian, so that my job is to continue to get that message out as much as I can.

Victoria Volk: Sounds like he was an old soul.

Christopher Cochran: Yeah. He was an old soul. He probably lived five other people’s lifetimes, you know, in in the short, you know, twenty two, twenty three years of age. He had traveled the world. He had been to India. He had been to to Prague. Study abroad, state of abroad in India. He’d done a lot. He lived big. And when I say big, he was, you know even as a character, he was the lead in every musical and every play. He’d been nominated for Gene Kelly, works here in Pittsburgh, which are a big deal. He was a kid who had already done it, been in a major motion picture. And he was moving everything forward. But I think instinctively he knew that I think he knew his life was gonna be short. That’s probably why he lived so big. And we just I think it makes sense. I guess now in a sense, how big he lived that that that it was so short, but but that’s that’s what we have to deal with today. That was three years ago. So, yeah, he passed away.

Victoria Volk: What was he studying in college?

Christopher Cochran: So Christian was an international studies major. He minored in Asian studies and he was a theater minor. So he was also in in college. He was at he would be in plays and things like that. He was in comedy troops. He was also on the he was also a d I say, I can keep going because there’s so much this kid did. He was a local limelight radio station in in Indiana, PA. He was also on there as well. So which we love to listen to and just his parents, we were so happy. We loved just hearing his voice. And so, you know, we listened to him. So, yeah, that’s what he studied. And, like, he he loved the travel. He was a minimalist too. You know?
He wasn’t he was an extreme minimalist because, you know, I do pretty well for myself. You know, I’m not I always have and do well, and my kids have always been have been lucky enough to live in a a nice home, nice neighborhood, and nice cars, and all those things. Christian was such a minimalist. He didn’t even like to drive our cars. You know? He was he he just didn’t he thought any of that stuff was too showy or, you know, the act of just packing a suitcase was enough for him to to go somewhere to to meet people. Whatever was on his back was fine with him. He was very authentic extremely funny, but at the same time, incredibly compassionate about a fellow man. Just incredibly compassionate. And there’s and I’m I knew that. But, you know, as when you’re some your your son passes, your child passes, and things start to pour on. You’ve been on the website Christian crocodortorek. You can see the messages, the stories that just pour in of the legacy that he has left. Upon so many and continues to this day to leave on so many. There there’s not enough earthly words to use other than they’re extraordinary. And I’m I feel so privileged that I got to be his dad.

Victoria Volk: We never really understand or know our impact, do we?

Christopher Cochran: I think Not till we’re not here, I guess.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. Yeah. What’s your favorite memory of him? Do you have a few or one that you would like to share?

Christopher Cochran: My favorite, ma’am. Well, I mean, of course, there’s so many. There’s no real favorites. I think anything where I got to be in the light of Christian was my favorite moments. I don’t you know, he he was funny. His jokes were sometimes his jokes were so they were so big. They they went over my head. They were like multilayered jokes. I and he had this because he was incredibly intelligent too. Right? He was just he had a photographic memory. He he could he had a quick wit, which can, you know, you you if you you heard his pockets, he’s just quick witted. He understood things quick. He was very knowledgeable. But, you know, my my best memories of of Christian and best stories of Christian their stories, of course, while he had cancer that are funny, But, and I can tell you that one, you know, I don’t I like to focus on the things when he didn’t have cancer, but I can tell you that I went on a long walk with Christian up to the point which, you know, he used to go on walks because I wanted him to continue to be, you know, walk and keep himself healthy and eat right and and we would go on these walks.
And it was one of the latter walks probably three months before he passed away. I don’t remember walking with him. And I said to Christian, Christian, what what regrets do you have in this life? You know? What what can you what can you put on to me? Because I always looked at Christians like a philosopher. He understood things so deeply. And and he said, dad, yeah, I have one regret. I do have one regret. I hung on every word of that regret. I said, what what’s the regret son? He was probably, like, something I did wrong or something. I yelled at the number. And he’s, like, no, dad. He’s, like, I did too much homework, and I I just started laughing. I said, what do you mean you did too much? There’s no, I I mean it that. That’s the biggest regret I have in this life that I’ve been on this earth is that I did way too much homework. I could have been doing other things, you know. And it was just and I used to just laugh because he hardly did any homework. You know? I mean, he really didn’t. This was the kid. I tell you this. His roommates would laugh because and and be so jealous a Christian. He would go to class. He never bought a book. I never had to pay for a book for college. Ever. Think about that.
He meant he he just would go to class. He memorized the information. He would take class. He was a straight age student. I remember his first year in college, he looked at me. He goes, because I was always on him. Like, you gotta get in. You know, you’d be good student. He goes, he looked at me. Is this a big scam?
Is this a scam? I go, what he means is this a scam? He goes, college seems like a scam. It’s too easy. I don’t understand. Now he’s in the Honors College too, so they’re pushing them. You know? But he he just he he yeah. He he didn’t like to do his homework. I buddy, clearly, he said he did too much homework. But he was just that made me laugh and and, you know, there’s he he just he had this incredible laugh too that I loved to just be in the aura sometimes the last year of his life, I moved all a lot of his he liked video games because he got to speak to his friends, you know. And this is during COVID. And I I always positioned my chair in the living room where we’re at that I could get a glance in to see him play his video games because I I just like watching him. You know? Because he was funny.
And he was making jokes, and he and so so I found that, you know, those moments were Christian. It’s it’s his laugh and his stories, his jokes, his his comedy, and just how he made you always feel made you feel good. He was the grown up. He was the only grown up.

Victoria Volk: You know, parents that have lost a child, especially, like, with a terminal illness. Well, I I would say anybody who has a family member that’s diagnosed with a terminal illness. There’s this phase of denial, I suppose, even towards the end, you know, it’s really difficult to let go and accept what’s happening. What did you how did you navigate that for your you and your your wife? And what advice would you impart on to people listening to this who find themselves in the same situation?

Christopher Cochran: That’s a tough question because, you know, everybody goes through it so differently and how they manage this. I mean, I’ve learned a lot, of course, after the fact, right, to so I can impart some knowledge whether someone is going through it you know, I think someone would tell me that, would I be able to take that information properly? I’m not sure I could. You know? I have learned that I’ve learned two things. One is to be humble before god. That’s my most important, you know, I’m always humbled, you know, then I I’m not I’m not worthy of his love. The the second thing is, you’re not in control. And when you realize you don’t have the control, you you kinda let go a lot of things. You can flow a little bit easier in this life, I think. But to answer your question during that time, I’ve been around and I’ve listened to your podcast, you know, and I’ve heard people talk and some people haven’t been around the end of life situations. They’ve either, you know, it’s new to them. And for me, you know, I was raised in a Luthrom family. I’m a catholic now, but who’s racing a Luther and a strong mother who was very religious. She took me a church all the time. I was an altar boy, you know, all those things. But I would my mom would take me to nursing homes, and she would So death was always sort of part of life. I understood that as a kid. I never I always accepted that as sort of the reality of how life was going to work. Certainly, it’s not I don’t like the reality that my child is taken from me. It’s in the natural order that your parents go and I’ve lost my parents and I know what that felt like and doesn’t feel anything like this. It’s different. This is like sticky glue. It’s so stuck on me. I can’t you’re never gonna get it off if you can’t. But I think The answer to your question is, I think from my perspective and how we navigated that, for me, I understood the ultimate outcome. I knew early on what was going to happen. Now, I never told my wife that. I never told my, you know, they were looking for hope. Right? And I always gave hope. I’m not a downer guy. I’m and I did. We worked very hard and we went to every doctor in the world. We went to the best facilities around this country. It had the means by which to do this. I was fortunate. Christian felt guilty. He’s his he’s dying. He feel guilty. He felt privileged. He said he felt so challenged by the guilt of that we gave him the special privileges to meet with the best doctors in the world on this, to try to solve this problem. He got on the best possible drugs, DNA’s and RNAs and sequencing. I mean, the amount of things we went through to save this kid’s life was not good enough. And but I knew ultimately time was it was always ticking in my head. Clock was always ticking. And I could hear the clock ticking constantly. And I think for my wife, I tried to shield my kids and my wife from those those the reality of that. It’s only towards the end when his body would break down in the last month when you could see what cancer does to the body and everything. But, you know, Christian remained humorous to the very end and continued to think about us to the very end. But I think the way you navigate the only way you can do is is to to push yourself forward to know that you just do the best you can. That’s all you can do and show immense love for one another. And know. You have to show love for one another when it ends too. Because that part that part of the year is extraordinarily difficult. I try not to think about it. I write about it, of course. But it’s even difficult to even think about it because there’s so much that went on that was difficult to go through, especially the last the last month and a half. But afterwards, it’s incredibly difficult for families. And for husbands and wives, statistically, they don’t stay together. And families fall apart because we don’t understand each other’s grief. And that’s true. I can tell you for the first year, I didn’t understand my wife’s grief because I might she’s grieving to me. Who else can she grieve to? And I’m and I’m grieving to her. And you cannot when two people do that, one has to, I suppose you have to listen, you have to be able to absorb it. As best you can and be there for that person to and recognize that each person is going through grief very differently. My kids are going through. Just lost their best friend, their brother. And how do I, you know, how do you navigate that and and be compassionate and patient? And so I think give yourself patience and love and give it as best you can to everyone around you. In the end, it it never gets I like to get better. It just gets it gets a little smoother, I suppose. He gets his arm is rough. And you can navigate a little bit better. You can navigate this life daily a little bit better. That’s really how we do as a family. We navigate it. I navigate life daily. It’s a daily thing. I don’t look in the past too much and I really don’t look to the future. Because the future is uncertain. I have no idea. Witten is something that I thought I understood. The future was so bright, but it got taken from me, and the family and from Christian. And so I can’t look too far in the future. I know what I have today. I know and I think that’s important. Be present. Be grateful for the moments that you have. And And if you know you’re you’re someone who’s gonna pass and and I knew with Christian, I memorized every crease on his body possible. I have it. It’s locked in my head. So I I think it’s just just making sure you do those things.

Victoria Volk: So what did that look like for you and your spouse and then holding the weight of your children’s grief as well? I mean, did you seek support each of you individually outside of each other?

Christopher Cochran: Yeah. Well, the first year, I think anybody goes through this and just doing my research, you may know better than I, but for us, it was like being a zombie. Is this if it didn’t even happen? I couldn’t even tell you that year what I remember. To me, it’s just a complete black hole because it wasn’t I wouldn’t even say it was bad. If this makes sense because the second year was the worst. And the third year is horrible too. You know, I’m in my third year. It’s still not good. I mean, it it I still it’s worse than the first year because the the first year you’re in such shock that life that turned on the dime so quickly And that happens to families all over this this world. Right? The life gets turned on the diamond an instant. And a second, life can be so beautiful and perfect. And then it gets turned and you’re upside down and you have no idea what’s Why would this happen? And you asked those questions of why God? Why God you do this? Why could you have done this to us? You know, we’re a good family. We go to church every week. We love each other. We’re always trying to do all the right things. That’s asked of us. And it still happens to us. So once you get past the whys and all those things and acceptance, I think for us it was, yeah, we did go to therapy. I’m not a therapy guy.
You know, not a a guy. I I’ve I’ve tried it, of course. And that’s a that’s something for individuals what they whatever they want to do, what’s good for them. Right? That’s why we say grieving is different for every single person. Part of my grieving or part of my therapy is talking to you. Part of my therapy is being able to talk about Christian’s story, writing the book, having interactions with others that gives me the chance to express whatever I feel and be authentic to that. Right? But I do therapy when my wife will ask me to do therapy. If she’s going and she says, hey, let’s go as a couple. I want you to come with me. Whatever she wants, I will do that. That’s no, I will do it in a heartbeat. It’s no problem for me. And I’m fully engaged with that. But you just don’t feel like I find when I come out of therapy, I feel worse. So in some ways. Because I’ve I’ve I’ve because I it is a safe space that I unload a lot in my head. And and some people can go, oh, that must feel good because you get everything out. But for me, it’s like I just unloaded and it’s too it’s it’s just I it resonates too much in my brain and I’m I’m you know, I think for for me as a person, it’s just it’s difficult. But for for most, my wife, it’s great and it works. Yes. That define the right person who’s compassionate and loving and English sentence and there’s no judgment. And if you do that, you it’s a wonderful thing. Very important to navigate it.

Victoria Volk: Your other children there close in age to Christian?

Christopher Cochran: His sister is fifteen months younger than Christian. Yeah. So they’re like, you can wait just beyond the Irish twins, as they call it? I think it’s what did the twelve months or something. Yeah, they’re like Irish twins, best friends.
She went to the same college she went to. All my kids go to the same college. It’s about an hour and a half away from here. And, yeah, they were they’re best friends and they were at college together, and he wrote all her papers. He poor kid.
He was she would rely at them. But

Victoria Volk: Maybe that was that homework he kept doing.

Christopher Cochran: Yeah. It was. It was. He was always doing things and he’s he didn’t just do it for my kids. I mean, he didn’t have his friends like friends at prestigious schools like Purdue and amazing schools and they go, Christian, I need help writing a paper. Can you help me write something and come up with ideas? And he was that smart. He just come up with great ideas and help, you know, he’s a beautiful writer. His matter of fact, during Christian’s cancer, I put this it’s actually, I think, on his website, Christian wrote his his entrance paper, just, I guess, I don’t know what they call that, but his entrance to get into grad school. So this is a kid again. In the summer, he passed away September first, he applied for graduate school in, I think, June or something, May or June. He got accepted. His paper was beautiful. And it was just all about, you know, how privileged his life was, how fortunate he has been, and he wanted to dedicate his new his life. I mean, if he survived, that he was gonna dedicate his life to helping those who were left alone with this awful disease. He wanted to be with I mean, he wanted to go over he felt that the world there were a lot of people dying overseas that had this disease. That were dying alone with someone not with them, and he wanted to be with them. So, you know, it’s a beautiful paper, well written. And so, yeah, his sister you know, was fifteen months par you know, below him. Totally different than Christian. She’s she’s in the wild one. She’s just full of energy and what was causing trouble. She’s sort of in between two boys. I I my youngest is a boy. And so she’s, you know, she’s got to fight with those two boys, you know. But the it’s a good girl, and she’s married lives in Norfolk, Virginia, married to a naval officer who serves overseas on the USS Coal. And So but she’s at work for a bank major bank. And then my younger son, he is a Nicholas. He is a junior now at the same college, studying the exact same thing as Christian at at college.

Victoria Volk: How did you support them through that whole ordeal that that year that he was when he was diagnosed and and after that? And

Christopher Cochran: Well, during the year,

Victoria Volk: I don’t Like, how do you hold all of that? Right? Like, how do you hold all of that?

Christopher Cochran: Well, my wife’s a nurturer. Okay? She’s she’s a it’s truly a beautiful human soul and she’s a yoga instructor, so she’s in tomb. She’s just just a beautiful person and beautiful. She’s nurturing. So she, you know, she’s there for those she’s there for the two kids and I think my mindset was very different then. You know, I was all about trying I’m I’m a doer, you know. Someone says, dig a ditch. And my head’s focused on digging the ditch. I’m not really thinking about everything else. I’m throwing dirt out. Right? I’m just to me, I was digging a ditch. I was I was trying to save my son’s life, you know. So it was a twenty four seven operation, you know. And I and I mean, it was twenty four seven, you know, I didn’t sleep a ton, catch catnaps when you could. But it was always my daily routine was just work, work, work, not my work. My work was doing what it needed to do, but was working on solving this challenge with Christian. And I wasn’t alone in it. My wife certainly helped. Her sister and her brother-in-law helped. We called the CC Advisory Group. We were just a client sort of this group that we get together to talk about solutions, figure things out. Where’s the best place? Don’t agree with in in I say this, don’t agree with what the doctors don’t know everything at all.
I figured out that I am the smart I was smarter than doctors shockingly. That should not be the case. But I am I was substantially smarter than doctors, that because of the hard work that the group us did, we were able when they originally didn’t find Christian’s DNA and RNA sequencing. I won’t name the facilities. I don’t want to get in trouble, but they didn’t find it through their sequencing. And it wasn’t good enough for us. You know, we’re like, I’ve got to keep searching. We’ve got to do more DNA. We’ve got to more find this out, sure enough somebody out in, I think Seattle a major DNA and RNA facility. And by the works of John and we went to John Hopkins as well, a doctor there helped us. We found the sequencing that Christian had very specific that allowed him to get onto a drug, pemigatinib, that is a full fledged FDA drug that’s out there for people with cholangiocarcinoma that can give you extra time. It’s not a it’s not a game changer, but it just gives you extra time. And we were able to find that sequencing after hard work and getting him on that drug. But unfortunately, it just it didn’t work. It just It didn’t Maybe it made I don’t it didn’t work, you know. We we we did everything. And Christian was one of the experimental kids for T cell therapy here in Pittsburgh, which the NIH in DC is one of the originators. Of this. And it’s where they basically harvest the t cells out of your body, grow it in a petri dish, grow billions and billions and billions of these things, and then ultimately shut your body down, you know, put it all back in you, and eat the cancer away from the inside. It’s the only way we were gonna win here. And I knew of one case of this happening. I knew I know her well. She’s a friend of mine. She’s very well known in the in the world of cancer. But the problem is to go on to that, he had to go off of chemotherapy for thirteen weeks.
And in that thirteen weeks, I’m sure his cancer. It it’s extremely aggressive and it attacks every part of the body. And so it was by that point, then we’re you know, it’s extremely. Once we realized the messaging, t cells were they weren’t working, you know. You get that coal. And you’re you just gotta scramble, like, fast. Get on the horn. Let’s get back on Kimo. What do we do? But, you know, towards the end, Christian just said, we had been doing experimental drugs. Guys, like, it’s okay. He never got involved. Christian never got involved his own. His own treatments. Meaning, he just said, whatever you guys wanna do, because I’m fine with it. You know? He was resigned to it all. He he was fine with it all. But I think towards the latter part where things were just not working. And he said, guys, this is I’m fine with no more. It’s okay. You know, I know I’m doing this for you basically. It’s what he was doing for us. Right? He was like, whatever you wanna do, but I’m okay.
You know? I’m at peace with what’s happening. You know? So So I’m not sure if I answered your question there, but, you know, I think we were talking about my other kids, but they, you know, they I think we’ve just for me, it was just I was so focused on solving Christian’s thing. I think my wife did a fantastic job just nurturing them. And then, you know, obviously, over time is when things were good and we’d have good days or Christian, you know, you you focus in on them and make sure they’re getting everything they need. But his his sister was at college, so she benefited from that. During that time in sense, they should have to be around it. Unfortunately, my younger son, I think, has felt the brunt of a lot of this because he was honed during COVID. And so he’s in the house all the time.
And he you know, he was there with Christian when he passed. He was in her house surrounded by his family. He was heavily involved as a as a sixteen, seventeen year old boy. That’s not exactly what you wanna have to go through. But, you know, he’s he’s he’s a good boy and he’s doing well.

Victoria Volk: Has that changed his trajectory of what he chose to endeavor in his life that experience?

Christopher Cochran: I don’t know yet. I mean, he’s obviously doing the same major. He’s had some, you know, get too much in the nick. Nick doesn’t like to Nick’s taken a different approach to everything. You know, his sister can talk about this. This is not something Nick can talk about. It’s not something that he is open about. You know? I had to make sure, you know, before I put the book out, I wanted Nick to read parts of the book that where I’d mention his name, some things I did take out, you know, things that are so personal to to Nick that he just wants to keep it for himself. Mhmm. But, you know, he he’s getting better at it, talking about it. But in terms of trajectory, don’t know yet. I know a lot of his friends, trajectories have all changed. You know, his his best friends have all changed their some are changed from being artists to now being their counselors for helping those with challenges because of Christian. There’s those who have followed their passions that they wouldn’t otherwise have followed. No one in particular is a CPA. A great job from left, graduate Penn State, CPA. Now he’s a comedian, you know, New York. He just told you He

Victoria Volk: just he just

Christopher Cochran: he just he just they just changed their directory because trajectory because of Christian that Christian because Christian of the group was going to be in many ways, you know, I say famous, but the most well known. He was from a young age, anybody in or in this whole community or neighborhood or Pittsburgh from a new Christian. I mean, he was incredibly talented and he was he was definitely destined and he was scheduled to go to LA before all this. I mean, he was destined just got he had everything he was ready and he was good looking boy had it all and he’s likable. It’s not like he had all the facets and he didn’t have this burning desire I don’t he he was okay. He, you know, you think like, oh, you better have all this desire to be the be famous. He didn’t have any of that. He just he took life as life came to him, and he got successful always doing it that way. Right? He always got everything he he whether it was grades or being in parts and things like that by not even trying. He just because he had that aura of just likeability and passion and fun to work with, and he just had that. And I always I just knew he was going to be incredibly successful. Even if he failed at something, he was just the one kind he’s not the one that let it bother him. He just was like, yeah, it’s fine. You know, like, we’ll do this, you know. And someone will be like, I like that about this this kid had something very different, you know.

Victoria Volk: He could pivot, you know.

Christopher Cochran: He pivot, yeah, he pivot on dime and never affected him. And he and I think that’s a major strength in anything, you know. And, yeah, he had that. So

Victoria Volk: Sounds like he taught everyone around him too how to be in the flow of life.

Christopher Cochran: And I talked about that in the book. Right? There’s Christian’s Dow. It’s a section in the book. And Christian believed in baptism, and and he understood the to your point, which is not flowing against the the current, flowing with the current. And he lived that very much that Christian was a strong Christian. We were Catholics. But the thing about Christian is he was very spiritual and he understood faith. He understood he respected them so much because there are a lot of similarities between all the faith. But the way Christian lived his life is does just being able to take things in and and and never afraid to be himself.
He would wear the goofiest clothes and he didn’t care. He could be bright colors. It could be googly sweaters, you know, from the eighties, you know. He’s an eighties guy. He loved his last tweet on Twitter. Is him in a wheelchair? This is the comedy of Christian. And he understood things. He’s got a a walkman on. And he goes, he goes jam into my eighties walkman or he may I I’m not gonna do this justice, but walkman, not lately. Meaning he’s not walking. I think he could just you you can’t walk anymore because of the Kansas market. Yeah. He he he just yeah. He he could make something that you would otherwise go and feel bad for him, but he would make you laugh about it. And that that’s such a unique trait to have under those circumstances.

Victoria Volk: What has your grief taught you?

Christopher Cochran: Well, my grief taught me that there’s much bigger grief than mine, I guess. There’s having a platform, you know, the book is is simply a a tool, you know. And my voice meaning people and connecting with people is the best form to understand grief. I recommend that to anybody who’s listening to to connect as best you can. I’ve connected so I I I go and I speak. Sometimes these speeches are about inspiration how to find the the light in the darkness or And sometimes it’s the students, young adults, university level, but sometimes it’s adults. And that will draw different crowds. So sometimes the crowds I will get will be those who are going through immense grief. Those who have either read the book, wanna get the book, you know something about the book, you know something about my story, and they wanna come and I make a very distinct point to try to talk to every single person who comes to see me. They’re going out of their way to see me. There’s something going on with them. And they’re using me. And I’m there to be a person to listen and to help. And so I listen to stories. And so what it’s taught me to answer your question is, The grief that I hear from others is far greater than my grief. If if that makes sense because some people are hurting so badly. I I mean, the stories I hear whether it’s they’ve lost their husband and two children. Or, you know, two children. I I can’t even fathom that, you know. So I I’m I think it’s taught me to understand my fellow, man, it’s also, breathing has helped me. To look at people as true souls. And what I mean by that is I don’t think I looked at people before cancer as souls. Meaning, when I look at someone I just saw them as a person and they’re on their way, whatever, I spend a lot of time when I sit or if I’m out in public and I watch people and I look at them and I realize they have a soul, they have a life, they something’s going on in their life, could be good, could be bad, much like all of us. And and I I think I’m just connected that way a little better now? Maybe I wish I wasn’t. Sometimes it can drag me down. But I guess it’s my purpose. You know, that’s I’m still trying to figure that purpose out, but I think that’s how I’ve learned the grief has helped me. That’s what I’ve learned from it. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: How would you describe and that kind of leads to my next question. How would you describe the Chris before Christian passed and the Chris now? You mentioned more connected, you know, maybe to even more spiritual in that way.

Christopher Cochran: Mhmm.

Victoria Volk: How else would you have described yourself before Christian passed?

Christopher Cochran: I was like a lot of people. I just I had goals, money, better car, bigger house, more stuff maybe. Give I love my kids, give them whatever they need, be there for my wife. I mean, I don’t know. I was just in a different mindset.
It’s a different it’s because life is perfect, you know. I mean, yeah, there’s there’s the normal things of life. Right? I mean, we all go through whether it’s maybe not enough or bills or someone passes away or it just I mean, it’s just normal stuff. But you navigate that pretty quickly and and you’re just on to to and and I used to hear of other people who would get sick. And I would do the be part of the cookie driver or whatever food drive and, you know, but I just did it, you know. And I had compassion for it. I just don’t think I really truly get it till I’m the guy getting the food drive or my son. I’m the guy who signs out in front of my house. I’m the one who’s, you know, where they give you the pity face or whatever that is, you know.
And It’s not about me. It’s just Christian. You know, I I I think I just I yeah. I I mean, I’m not I’m just not that guy. I don’t even know who that guy is. I I I I tried to look back on that guy and I just kinda think of him as kind of a not a I don’t know. I don’t like that guy. And I I mean, I mean, I wasn’t a bad guy. I’m just saying, I’m not sure I recognize that person because now I look at life very differently. I look at other people differently. I try to give everybody kindness at the fullest extent. You know, even when someone’s mean to me. It’s okay. I’m okay with it. The old one be like, you know, say anything. Be mean right back to you. You know? That’d be brutal. But I I don’t I mean, I don’t want any of that. I don’t I want nothing to do with that.
Because I think in the end, you know, for me, it’s I think for my family too is the ultimate goal is I wanna go see Christian again. I’m not gonna get there from a do good things. It’s not gonna happen. So I I I think my focus is how do I get to see this kid again? Because I miss them.
So

Victoria Volk: How do you think it’s changed your wife in your marriage?

Christopher Cochran: Yeah. It’s changed it. Definitely changed her. I mean, you know, she’s it’s her first born. You know? He’s Yeah. It’s changed her. Totally. You know, she’s still sweet, loving, but it’s a daily routine. Right? It’s a daily it’s a daily struggle. I’ll put it that way. It’s a daily struggle. You know, in terms of marriage, we love each other and what is different? You know, how can it not be different?
Mhmm. It’s just different. It’s just different. It’s not bad. You know, I mean, we but it’s different because, you know, it’s you you you struggle you’re I think it’s a struggle for her too. Right? The witness if I go through difficult things too. Right? Doing doing talks or speaking. Even this discussion today it takes a lot out of me.
Right? It will end. When you go about our lives, it still takes a bit of chunk of my body out of me. And I think that’s the same way for us. It’s like when you talk about her, you go through it. It’s a reminder. Right? Nothing’s changed in my house. Right? And since Christian’s room is the same as when he left it, his shoes are here, his, you know, nothing from that perspective, but he’s just not here anymore.
So for her, it’s yeah, it’s it’s she’s a mother. Right? And I’m sure mothers who listen to this will get it. I mean, it’s it’s bad for a dad too. Don’t get me wrong. It is. It’s horrible. But I just think a mother has a a different connection with their children. They bore that child. They brought that child into this world. And she’s a nurturing parent. She she in a ways his kindness is driven off of his off of how she’s Raised him? We both raised him. I’m more of the tough. Get it done. Let’s go. You know, she’s soft and gentle and caring. And so, you know, I think it’s yeah. It’s tough for her. It’s tough for her.

Victoria Volk: How have you taken care of intended to yourself as a grieving man and spouse? You know, it’s easy for women to talk about self care and all of that, but when it comes to men, which, oh, no, of course. You know, you kind of alluded to that, but a lot when parents are grieving a child or a lot of the focus does go on the mother. Right? And the husband in the spouse, the father is not disregarded or not, but they don’t get as much attention.
Right?

Christopher Cochran: No. I I get it.

Victoria Volk: And so I wanna, you know, what helped you personally, like, in self care in the year’s sense, particularly.

Christopher Cochran: Yeah. I mean, it’s just staying busy. I mean, I’m a simple guy. I’m on a you know, there’s no complexity. I have I have certainly have my moments I talked to Christian a lot, so I have a relationship with Christian, you know, much like I have a relationship with God. It’s sometimes good, sometimes not so good, but it’s a relationship. I talk I just talk to Christian. That’s and I hear him. So, you know, that gives me a lot of comfort. I I can absolutely hear. So, for me, it’s it’s stay busy, stay active, stay constantly engaged, with guy things, I guess, whether it’s working on a car or just working on my business, you know, writing, you know, those are the things that occupy me. As a man. And of course, being engaged with my other children, you know, and my wife doing things. Right? It’s very important. Going on vacations together, you know. We’re gonna go to Europe, I think, this December. For a couple weeks to get away. So we do things together. You know, we’re we’re tightening it and we love being around each other.
And so I think, you know, I I try to put a lot of effort in as best I can. To those things. And most importantly, my family, my kids, talk to them every day, always communicate constantly. Sometimes my daughter does one hear from me, but, you know, like, have you just called me, leave me alone. But I just like hearing my kids, so make sure they’re okay. I mean, I’m so I’m part of, you know, it’s so funny back in my day. My parents probably didn’t care where the heck I want. You know? I don’t know if you were the same way. I was like, I I got on my bike and as a kid and when it started to get darks when I came home. And my parents, you know, they were great parents. It’s just the way life was. Right? And today, we’re like, helicopter parents. We don’t know where they’re always at. I mean, my daughter’s married, and I still have my find my iPhone. I know where she’s at all the time, you know.

Victoria Volk: She knows I turned that off on you.

Christopher Cochran: No. No. She knows they do it, you know. And she’s okay with it. She she knows that. And she’s fine with it. Plus, I think I pay her bills though. I don’t know why I still do that, but before I go to sleep at night and lame, I’m go to sleep. I wanna see where they’re at. Are they okay? Are they safe? You know, my wife too does the same thing. So I mean, so we’re probably a little obsessive on that, but you know, I think you know, it’s natural for us too. Right? We were always that way when Christian was here, interestingly enough, probably more for Christian, even before the cancer. I always you know, my wife and I would always you know, so one thing we prayed about is our whole life having kids is just to keep them safe. I don’t care about anything else. Money is irrelevant. Everything’s irrelevant. Right? Being safe, healthy, alive is all that matters because you can fix everything else. Everything’s fixable. Money’s fixable. Relationships can be fixed. You know? But I can’t fix death. I can’t fix it when they’re hurt. And I think with Christian in particular, I always was nervous about Christian. Always. I’ve never not been nervous about Christian in particular, not because he got into bad things or something like that. It’s just he was such a good kid He was always doing good things. He was just so good and a nice boy and loved us deeply. Loved his family deeply that it always was a concern of mine that something was gonna be happen. Just because he’s just too good. Can’t be this good.
I can’t be allowed to have it this good. You know?

Victoria Volk: Sounds like he had an adventurous spirit too.

Christopher Cochran: Oh, yeah. I will tell you that, like, we would go. We would go on trips as a group, and he was always the most daring of all of us. So if there was a road like like gooey like here and he Christian would be the one to take us down a beaten path. Like, he was always the one that got like, we need to go down that road because there’s gonna be something really awesome down that road.
I’m telling you, and be like, Christian, please stop this shenanigans. You know? Like, we’re we have a destination. We have time schedule. He said, no. No. No. No. No. Yeah. We trust me on this. It’s gonna be great. And we trust him because he’s smart and he Sure enough. It’d be something extraordinary, you know. It’d be like a giant mountain west and you’d be like go here and it’d be a giant crater in the middle of the desert. And and it is goofy as that is and baseline as that is. It’s like the beauty of it all, just to gather, see this. It it creates a incredible feeling and he but he knew that. He knew that he was gonna create something special for us. And so he had a way of doing that all the time, which is constant. So, yeah, he’s adventurous and always sort of creatively thinking of ways to to think differently.

Victoria Volk: What do you look forward to most in co creating in your life that has been inspired by Christian?

Christopher Cochran: Well, to continue for me, it’s the legacy of Christian is what’s good about today. Right? I think the truth is I don’t really know. I don’t again, I don’t look too far. You know, that’s my point. I really do focus on today. I focus on the moment my present moment with you. I’m all in with you. Right? I haven’t thought really other than the questions you asked me. It’s it’s just about you and me today right now. Some often students, something else and present there. But I think I have found that things kinda come my way. Right? It’s the dows them of things, I let things flow the way they’re going to flow. And in Christian’s legacy things tend to flow, come up out of nowhere. Whether it means someone wanting me to speak somewhere, whether it means someone else taking the initiative to to build something around Christian. Right? There are a lot of things that are going on around Christian that I’m not always I get, you know, if you wanna call it approval, but people call and say, hey, we’re doing this whole thing around Christian. What’s good about today, and they’re implementing it in school districts now. Right? It’s they’re working with teachers now to implement what’s good about today in K-twelve. Especially younger kids where they have a board says what’s good about today and kids come in in the morning. Right? What’s good about their day? And the first thing in the morning, and then the day they erase it the next day, come and do it again. And it’s a teaching tool prepared for teachers to be able to see how their students How their day is? Right? They can identify kids who are not having good days

Victoria Volk: of that.

Christopher Cochran: And they can see where things are not going well in certain areas. But it’s just a way to help children too young because I do believe you know, sometimes when we’re old and we don’t get this messaging when we’re young about understanding the beauty of every single day. We forget about it and we got old. And we forget about gratefulness. We forget about presentness. We forget about all those things. Because we get caught up in the minutiae of keeping up with the Joneses and doing all these things, things, you know, to dos. But I do think, you know and Christian used to have something used to call him to love list. He didn’t have to do list. He had to love list. And so I try to do the same thing. It’s just how much love can I give out today? And so I to to I don’t know where it takes me. I only know, you know, what tomorrow will come and and and new things will pop up. And and and I’m usually a yes, you know, the yes guy is like, yeah, let’s do it. Whatever it takes, whatever it is to educate, whatever it is to to get this word out about what’s good about today. Help them ask themselves that question in the morning, the afternoon, in the evening, so they can reflect and see that life was so beautiful and and and it is. So that’s my help.

Victoria Volk: I love that idea too. My sister-in-law is super intended. I’m gonna mention it to her.

Christopher Cochran: Please love to get it out there in North Dakota. Right?

Victoria Volk: Yeah. Yeah.

Christopher Cochran: That would be amazing. Yeah. That would be wonderful.

Victoria Volk: He kinda touched on it that your relationship with Christian has continued when you talk to him. How do you how would you describe how that has helped you in your healing, your spiritual beliefs around that, that there is something after?

Christopher Cochran: Great question. Well, I I firmly and absolutely believe there is somewhere we all go. I do I know this because I I actually talk about it in the book that Christian came and visited me about two weeks after his passing. So this happened prior to Christian passing, I remember being close to him and asking him with crying. I remember this. And this buried in his neck and say, Christian, I need you to do me a favor, and he said, sure dad, whatever you want. And I said, look, I I need you. You have to. You have to. Come see me after you’re gone. It’s it’s so important because we’re gonna be a wreck. It’s you know, I said, we need I need some understanding of this stuff, you know. He said, dad, I promise. I promise you. I will be back. I promise you. This is absolutely and this is a kid when he meant he said it, he meant it, and I knew it. So about a week after Christian passed, hope you don’t mind me going into the story.

Victoria Volk: No. I don’t.

Christopher Cochran: Okay. So a week after Christian passed, I was muddling down to the mailbox, down my hill. And as I’m walking down the hill to my mailbox, I can see the male carrier coming down the street. And she had a green bell in her car for rep, Christian left green. And she subsequently had written this before again and said, listen, I wanted you to know something about your son that we didn’t know. Your son, every time I’ll be on my mail routes and he saw me, he’d pull over and come and talk to me. And tell me, and he’s I don’t have anybody who does that. Everybody runs from the male person. She goes, I don’t know why. But your son was the one who would come to me and wanna know about my life and ask if I was doing good and how my life was and you know, and so she’s like, he’s so important, you know. And I was like, yeah. I hear that from a lot of people. So as I’m walking down, instead of reaching about where she’s coming out, she hands me the mail. As I’m reaching out for the mail, this beautiful blue butterfly flying. I don’t get butterflies around here. Beautiful blue butterfly huge lands on my hand. And I’m, you know, I’m in a bit of weird state anyway, and I looked at her and I said, am I am I seeing things? Because I thought maybe I was hallucinating. I didn’t know probably was on medication at the time, but she said, nope. That I’m seeing exactly what you’re seeing. And I was like, okay. And that butterfly sat there for ten, fifteen seconds, just hanging out on my hand. And I’m home in the mail, not moving. And fluttered and disappeared. And I was like, okay. And I I I always had the sense of butterflies and people talk about butterflies and what they mean. And I’m okay. It’s what it is and told my wife and showed up to another week later, a lane in bed. And I remember this as if I’m here talking to you, I was put in a position in a basement. I got I’m in a basement. I’m there’s cinderblocks I mean, it’s a cinderblock old home as if it’s just been built. And there’s a a patio walkout door, and it’s green. It’s green. Bright lights, really pretty. Oh, and oh my gosh.
I’m in somebody’s house. Why am I what are we doing here? As soon as I said that, I got moved into a foyer. And the foyer’s an old it was tile, you know, a little square tiles Mhmm. You know, kinda like bied by fives, tiles, gray. And the door is like a nineteen seventies door, eighties door had a had a step ladder windows, if you you remember? Mhmm. Couldn’t see out of them. And it wouldn’t do her. And I remember thinking, oh, great. I mean, what the heck am I? And I remember turning to my left and about ten, fifteen, feet away is Christian at a mantle fireplace. By the way, lots very bright, very beautiful. There’s two chairs sitting to the left in front. They swiveled, and there were two people on them. They were shadow a figure, but they were moving. They were shadows. I couldn’t make who they were or what they were. And Christian’s in his beautiful, beautiful hair in his one of his sweaters, smiling. He had that he had this smile that it was like, see, told you I’d be back. You know, he didn’t have to say it. And I, of course, immediately wanted to rush to Christian, you know, run. But as soon as I had started to move, he immediately was in my face. He was right there in my face. And I, of course, put my arms around him I I could smell Christian. I could and he started to talk to me. He said, hey, dad. He said, listen. I love you. I need you to tell mom everything is okay. Everything is fine. I’m very happy. Everything’s gonna be fine. And you guys need to move on. And I said, Christian, I love you. I love you. I’m just I’m talking. I’m feeling that every bit of him and you know, I didn’t see any ellipse movie and I, you know, kind of wrap me talking to me and is and and I remember by the way I should say that not only did I see these two people, I could design the whole room to you because there was like a step kitchen up there and people are mulling about in shadows. Like, it was almost like I was invited to a dinner party or something, like I was somebody’s house. I don’t know whose house. I just assumed it was Christian’s house maybe or his apartment makes sense because of the door. I don’t know, but I I know for a fact what I experienced was not a dream because I didn’t wake up. I was in this weird state. I can’t remember any dream I’ve had, honestly. The only thing I remember and was that moment and how deep it was and how real it was. And so he just faded away and I faded back into who I was. And I sat there for about an hour. Just I didn’t wanna wake up my wife. She was next to me and tell her, But I for about an hour just sat there, so I can’t believe what just happened to me. You know, I I’m just I’m in this unbelievable you know, I can’t believe it. You know? He said he do it. He did it. I went somewhere, I wasn’t supposed to go. This was not a dream. I was like, then I tried convincing, yeah, it was a dream. Oh, wait. Well, I couldn’t have been a dream. I smelled him he was real. I was there. And so my wife woke up about an hour later and I told her what had happened. It’s verbatim. She says, Chris, last night, I went out on the porch. I prayed to Christian so deeply. Just ask him to come see us come see us please.
Because I never told her, you know, this discussion I have with Christian. And then I told her this, and this is what happened. And he’s never come to visit Danielle. It’s never happened. And I have subsequently not seen Christian since then in any form of state like that. You know, I’ve had dreams that are weird and but nothing to this that was as crystal clear as this. Christian does talk to me. I do hear him. I’ll ask him questions. Sometimes about life and just the other side, what’s going on?
Sometimes I’ve tried to reach out to him, he doesn’t get back to me. It’s not instantaneous. Sometimes he’ll come back to me and with frustration. Like, what do you need now? Like, I’m I get a sense he’s very busy. So, you know, he compassionately, sweet, nice to me. Just my like, hey, what do you what can I do to add? I’m busy with stuff, you know? Any What can I get you? You know?
What do you need? And Sometimes it’s just reassurance, you know. So that that’s what I hear. It’s gotten a little less now, but I still do it. Just just not not constantly.

Victoria Volk: There’s a I I had a conversation. Thank you for sharing all of that. Mhmm. First of all, I had a conversation with an intuitive Helen Gretchen Jones. It’ll be coming out around the time of your episode too, but I’ve had other mediums that say that those who have crossed over describe it like school, and it’s almost like community. It’s like they’re in community. So when you said that, it reminded me of those conversations of how they’re never really they’re not alone. Right? They’re they’re in community with others mingling. Yeah. Yeah.

Christopher Cochran: Yeah. I’ve asked Christian that question too, actually interestingly enough, like, you know, when you die, I’ve I’ve said, oh, do you have famous? Because there’s so many people who die, you were famous. Right? I mean, this lifetime. And like are you friends with famous people? Do you hang around with famous people? And his answer is no. I don’t. You know, that’s not my and that makes sense. I do hang around with people who are famous, but they’re not people you would ever know. Like, they’re obscure famous people. Like, the most obscure people that no one’s ever gonna know, but they were in their moment, had some form of they were they were important or, you know, yeah, I find that interesting. But I much of his friends are just regular people. You know, just normal people for the most part from everything he tells me that it’s just a it is communal. It’s it’s not much different as it’s explained to me in the way that it has been explained in the short conversations, Krishna, is that it’s not dissimilar to this. In many ways, you know, there’s much to do. You’re never bored. You know, there’s lots of choices and you can be with your friends. You can you know, you can check-in on people, loved ones, you can do all those things, which so sometimes he’ll tell me things that are so above me in my brain, and sometimes I can’t even explain them. I don’t know how that even makes sense. Like, he’ll explain a a multi level thing that’s something happening that I don’t even know how to explain it. Like, I I wouldn’t even know how to I’m not smart enough to be able to regurgitate it back out to another human without it sounding like I’m completely insane. Like I it’s not like he said something so it’s just like it it has so many layers to it that it that I don’t know how to explain it properly. And just leave it with inside my brain of sort of rolling around and figuring it out as best I can.

Victoria Volk: Is there anything else that you would like to share that you don’t feel you got to?

Christopher Cochran: No. I think you’ve gotten a lot about me. Like I said, it sounds like I was in therapy here. No, I just think those who are listening who are going through grief and I think what you offer here is very important. It’s very important because Grief is something not everybody’s gonna go through.
It’s it’s a universal trait that we all are gonna have it. You don’t think you’re gonna have it. You’re gonna get it. Mhmm. But I think it offers an opportunity to explore how each of us navigate it, how best to navigate it. And ultimately, for me, it’s I I want people to remind themselves is that and I I say it, what’s good about today is because I want them to focus on today. Focus on the beauty and what you have around you right now, your family, kids, anything that can bring you a little bit of pieces of joy into your heart. Right? Because if you’ve lost someone there’s a chunk that just gets ripped out of you. And your job is just to continue to fill it with little pieces. Happiness is that elusive thing. Right? I don’t know that I’ll ever be happy. Maybe I’ll be happy when my daughter, and as you’re first born, and that will bring me some happiness. And I’m sure it will. And I’m sure I I find those things when I can. But joy, pieces of joy are what I I try to pick up along the way. So I tell people pick up pieces of joy every which way you can. Something that makes you brings you some joy in your life and I think if you continue to build upon that, you build something in a good solid puzzle in your heart and you can can learn to continue to move forward in this life, you know. It’s all very short anyway.
I mean, that that’s not the downer part of me. I’m not trying to be a downer. It’s just that when you really think about it, it’s extremely short. And you just wanna leave a good legacy. You wanna do the right thing. You wanna help as many people as you can. Help put your energy into helping others. And I think that’s that can help you in grief. Right? Helping others who are hurting. Right? It’s a it’s it’s a good way to navigate your own grief is to see other people’s hurt and help them because now you’re just suffering is it is part of the human condition. It is what we do to get closer to God. It’s what gets us closer to all things. The more we suffer. Unfortunately, I think that is by many means and at least I’ve convinced myself that I’ve been asked to suffer. My family’s been asked to suffer because it gets us closer to god. It allows us to get to where we need to be forever. This is short. That’s what I would leave.

Victoria Volk: That’s beautiful. And it makes us more compassionate is what we’ve described as it brings out the compassion. Our suffering comes out our compassion. It can bring we have a choice. Right? It brings out our compassion or or if we project out our pain onto others.

Christopher Cochran: That’s true. And I I think suffering isn’t in the form of your own suffering, of course. But the more you take on of other people suffering know that sounds a lot of people run from suffering. Most people run from suffering. Right?
Because they don’t wanna deal with it. Right? I don’t wanna deal with that problem. But I would tell you to run to it.

Victoria Volk: You know the bunch

Christopher Cochran: of suffering.

Victoria Volk: Is the Buffalo?

Christopher Cochran: Yeah. Oh, what’s the Buffalo?

Victoria Volk: Well, Buffalo. I’m in North Dakota. Remember Right. I guess you buy some.

Christopher Cochran: Right?

Victoria Volk: But Buffalo actually run through a storm because they know it’s a shorter path to where they need to go instead of taking the long way and going around it. Buffalo actually go through the storm.

Christopher Cochran: I didn’t know that.

Victoria Volk: You

Christopher Cochran: see, I’m in Pittsburgh. We don’t get buffalo. Oh, there used to be buffalo around here, you know. It used to be a lot of buffalo, but But, yeah, you you have it, so you would know.

Victoria Volk: Bison is it’s very good too.

Christopher Cochran: I know they I see it on the menu a lot. I see it a lot. But, yeah, no, that’s I I think run the suffering. Can be a big reward.

Victoria Volk: One final question.

Christopher Cochran: Mhmm.

Victoria Volk: What’s good about today?

Christopher Cochran: Good about today? Well, it’s easy. I’m here with you. I get to talk about this. I get to speak to your audience. I get to share Christian’s story. I get to remind people the goodness in the day. So today, what’s good about today is that I am here with you talking about this. So that was an easy one because and with you. So anything I’m doing in the moment is what’s good about today.
So it’s it’s definitely what’s good about today. And I I’m very appreciative of the opportunity to speak with you.

Victoria Volk: It was wonderful having you.

Christopher Cochran: Thank you. Where can

Victoria Volk: people find you if they would like to reach out? Learn more about the foundation, organization, the book, all of that?

Christopher Cochran: Yeah. So first and foremost, if you go to you could Google Christian Cocker and you’d probably pull up all kinds of stuff. If you went to christian corker dot com or dot org, you’ll find all kinds of information on Christian, which is really the most important thing to me is just that you know my son. And everything else after that is good too, but that’s most important to learn about his legacy and how he lived his life. Because I do believe that, you know, the more you learn about Christian and the things that he did, he can help you learn little pieces how to lead a purposefully driven life. You can certainly pick up my book on that website, but you can also find me at chris cochronspeaks dot com, which is where I do speaking engagements, sell the book. And the book is available on Amazon. It’s available at Barnes and Noble. It’s available for global distribution, and I hope people hope people read it. It’s a love story. So I wanna make sure people understand that this is not a, you know, certainly you can get a lot from it and learning about how grief, the navigate grief. But I try to explain this is really a love story. It’s a love story about a family. Love story about family has gone through the worst thing and how we navigated it, but telling a story about how Christian led his life And that’s the point. To me, it’s a it is a book about a purposely driven life, not my purposely driven life. That’s why it says Chris Cochrane inspired by Christian Cochrane because it’s really him. And it’s me trying to explain how he lived a life that we could all take pieces from. And do do better in this life.

Victoria Volk: Thank you so much for sharing. And I will put those links in the show notes. And remember, when you unleash your heart, you unleash your life. Much love.

Ep 220 Helen Gretchen Jones | Signs, Synchronicities, and Spirit Teams: A Guide to Spiritual Connections

 

SHOW NOTES SUMMARY:

Helen Gretchen Jones, a death doula and intuitive channeler, shares her inspiring journey into shared death experiences and spiritual consciousness. With a rich background in art history, theology, sound therapy, Reiki, hypnosis, and past-life regressions, Helen now dedicates herself to supporting the dying and those they love in life and after death.

The innate gift of connecting with those who have crossed over has profoundly shaped her understanding of life and death, despite those around her not nurturing her gifts when she was younger.

Helen’s personal experience with grief began when she foresaw her father’s passing months before it happened—a vision that propelled her mission to help others find closure before dying. As a death doula influenced by such personal loss, she emphasizes the importance of addressing unresolved issues for smoother transitions at life’s end. Her stories illustrate how healing through vulnerability supports forgiveness and transformation.

Key Takeaways:

  • Trust Personal Experiences: Embrace signs as validations from spirit teams.
  • Open Dialogue About Death: Encourage authentic communication even amidst difficult conversations.
  • Healing Power in Vulnerability: Allow raw emotions to foster collective healing.
  • Community Support Matters: Initiatives like No One Dies Alone (NODA) highlight crucial human connections at the end of life.

This episode weaves together insights about grief’s somatic manifestations alongside practical advice for processing loss—including meditation practices—and explores how openness can transform entrenched narratives hindering healing journeys.

This episode invites listeners to keep an open mind and heart and allow curiosity beyond skepticism to take root so that healing can occur, which is often experienced unexpectedly and in the most delightful ways. The universe (and our guides) have our backs and are waiting for us to co-create with them!

RESOURCES:

CONNECT:

Embracing the Journey of Grief and Spiritual Connection

In a world where life and death are often viewed as polar opposites, there exists a unique space that intertwines these experiences into one cohesive journey. This is the realm explored by Helen Gretchen Jones, a death doula whose work focuses on shared death experiences and spiritual consciousness. In an enlightening episode of “Grieving Voices,” Helen shares her profound insights into how we can foster loving connections with our spirit team while navigating life’s inevitable end.

The Role of Intuition in Understanding Life’s Transitions

Helen prefers to call herself an intuitive rather than a medium, highlighting her comfort with this term which allows her to connect deeply without preconceived labels. Her childhood was marked by interactions with deceased individuals and what she describes as her spirit team—an experience not commonly shared among peers but one that shaped her understanding of life’s transitions early on.

Techniques for Recognizing Signs from Beyond

A significant aspect of Helen’s work involves helping people recognize signs from their spirit teams. She encourages openness to subtle synchronicities in daily life—a feather at your feet when you’re thinking about someone or an unexpected song playing just when you need it most. Trusting these signs can lead to deeper spiritual awareness and personal growth.

The catalyst for Helen’s path was the sudden loss of her father—a vision she had months before his passing spurred her commitment to help others find closure before death strikes unexpectedly. As a death doula, she witnesses firsthand how terminally ill individuals transition through stages—from anger and control struggles toward acceptance aided by visions of loved ones who have passed.

Providing Peace at Life’s End

Death doulas like Helen play crucial roles in ensuring peace for both those nearing the end-of-life stage and their families left behind; they address unresolved issues creating smoother transitions filled with healing opportunities rather than fear-driven chaos often associated with dying processes today.

Insights Into Afterlife Beliefs & Their Impact On Living Relationships

Helen believes strongly in structured afterlives where learning continues posthumously akin schooling systems here earthside – helping souls understand past actions’ impacts better thus facilitating reconciliation even beyond physical existence itself! Ignoring such possibilities only frustrates spirits trying desperately communicate important messages back home again…

Her narrative suggests interconnectedness between living-spiritual dimensions urging listeners shift skepticism towards embracing creative mindsets co-creating realities alongside unseen allies guiding us every step way forward together united purposefully always onward ever upward!

Episode Transcription:

Victoria Volk: Hello, and welcome to another episode of grieving voices. Thank you for being here and listening to today’s guest, Helen Gretchen Jones. She is a death doula, intuitive, and channeler, who writes about shared death experiences in the essence of spiritual consciousness. Her writing focuses on fostering loving connections with oneself and others, and her work emphasizes, trusting, per personal experiences and the teachings she channels from her team and spirit known as the a team. Ellen holds a dual master’s degree in art history and theology from Saint Edward’s University. She’s a certified and soundful therapy, rakie, hypnosis and past life regressions, and when she’s not working with hospice patients, writing or teaching how it can be found on the family ranch hanging out with her husband, Taylor, their children, Ty and L, and managing all of their many animals. Thank you so much for being here.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Thank you so much for having me. I’m excited to be here today.

Victoria Volk: It’s been a little while since I’ve had someone who well, you didn’t say you’re a medium, but I kind of feel like that’s a little bit of what you’re talking about. Is that true?

Helen Gretchen Jones: It is. My friend gives me a hard time. She’s a medium, and she goes, hi, can we just use the word? I use intuitive because I don’t I don’t know why. I guess I’m more comfortable with the word intuitive.

Victoria Volk: Okay. That’s fair enough. It’s been a while since I’ve had a medium on, but it seems like I was just telling somebody this not that long ago. I’ve had so many instances. Almost I I think actually almost every instance of recording with somebody, I go listen back to edit, and there is always this third voice.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Oh, how nice.

Victoria Volk: Comes in. And I remember one in particular. It was Becky Ellis. And she was talking about her dad, and there was she was sharing a story about her dad. And this very distinct male voice was in my recording that said, no.
And so when it happens, I share it with the guest, and they’re never surprised. It seems but she’s not a medium. And so but usually, it’s been when there’s been a medium. And so I’m kinda curious after I edit this one or when I go to edit this episode if there’ll be somebody making their appearance in the recording. And I don’t include it when it goes live. Actually, no. I do. It is. And when it goes live, but you don’t hear it, I’m trying to think. You know, I’m I don’t usually play back my recordings.
Like, I don’t listen after

Helen Gretchen Jones: They better them. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. I do take out the piece and I save it to share with the guests, but yeah, I don’t know if people can actually hear it because you know I think you’ve got to be because I don’t hear it of course when we’re recording and the guest doesn’t hear it. Right? It’s only when I play it back.

Helen Gretchen Jones: And, you know, I’ve done experiments with the voice recording where you listen for the voice through the editing process, and I’ve had voices come in during editing that I did not hear when I was recording.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. So you’ve had that experience.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Of

Victoria Volk: course, you’ve probably had that experience yourself. Yeah.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Well, I was intentionally testing for that, you know, just running experience and seeing. And on one, it was quite a lot. And some, of course, I don’t hear anything. But

Victoria Volk: so when did this? This is a great lead to to when did you realize this gift that you had? And does it I was listening. I was watching this I don’t know what it was on. It was a Oh, it’s unsolved mysteries. Mhmm. I think on Netflix or whatever, and there was an episode about a guy that had this has this spirit that’s been always with him since he was a child named Becky. And Like, she’s, like, his a team. Like, you were kinda talking about, like, she’s, like, on his team and helps him help people. He’s only heard her actual voice one time and it was in the presence of somebody else and it was documented and it’s pretty incredible episode actually. But when did you realize this gift that you had?

Helen Gretchen Jones: So I have been able to tune in for lack of a better word. I I would say connect. I’ve been able to connect to my team and spirit and to other spirits when I was very, very little four or five. I remember, I didn’t know it was unusual at the time. It just felt like it was, I don’t know, normal or commonplace, but it wasn’t until I was probably twelve or thirteen. When I started realizing that it maybe wasn’t normal when these experiences were shared. Like, people would be like, no. That didn’t happen or no. That person wasn’t actually there or I believe you believe that’s what you saw. So then you start to kind of put it together that maybe other people aren’t experiencing the same stuff and you have a you’re out of fork in the road at that point. You can either believe that you’re making it up and it’s imagination completely or you can trust yourself and maybe recognize that not everybody is living or having the same experience at the same time. That’s a hard age. It’s a tough age. But for me, the experiences with my team and spirit and with spirit in general were so beautiful, so transformative, and we’re desperately needed in challenging times. They made everything feel okay that when I would share it with my parents and they would say, I believe you believe that’s what you saw. It didn’t make me question my experience. It made me question the wisdom of my parents. And anyone else I shared. So I was the experiences were so transformative that it made me wonder if I could believe what they were saying. And also middle school, you know, that’s also around the time when you’re experiencing, you know, all your childhood make believe, your Santa Claus and your Easter bunny, and all tooth fairy, and all of those things. And so you start to see that maybe things that your parents are saying, maybe you need to trust your own experiences first.

Victoria Volk: Well, and how did that change, like, your friend like, did you have friends that you could share that your experiences with? Or were they, like, no. Just don’t tell me about that stuff.

Helen Gretchen Jones: You know it’s so funny. Most of them were a little more fearful, I think. And so I would keep it to myself, but what I couldn’t understand was it wasn’t fearful at all. It was beautiful and amazing and awesome. But I have some I have a high school friend that I’m still friends with that we, you know, kind of keep up through social media and on occasion when we see each other through big life events or something. Her name is Donna, and she told me recently, like, in the last couple of years,

Victoria Volk: she goes, yeah, I used to

Helen Gretchen Jones: say the weirdest things when you were little. My mom remembers it, like, when we so I guess I must have said stuff that they didn’t make me feel uncomfortable about even though it struck them as odd.

Victoria Volk: Mhmm. When did you realize who your a team was? Like and when when you say when when I hear a team or when I read read a team, I was like, oh, yeah, mister t.

Helen Gretchen Jones: I know. No.

Victoria Volk: If you’re that generation, but you know, is that how you came like, how did you come up with a team? First of all, I’m just curious.

Helen Gretchen Jones: That’s so funny. So when I was decided that they were always a collective and certain personalities or voices would emerge from the collective, they always felt a bigger part of something, but sometimes I think humans need a physical appearance or a name or something that they can more readily connect to to make the, you know, bigger collective feel more approachable. So and relatable. So my collective is I they’re a collective for sure, but sometimes individual personalities will kinda pull through like a wave pulling up from the ocean before coming back in to the collective. So I decided to call them a team. It was something that popped into my mind fairly recently. I think it might have been twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen, just to give a name to the collective. And my husband was like, oh, the a team. Like, the, you know, the crime fighters from the nineteen eighties or something. It’s so t. Yeah. So t. I’ve been in full. Right? That’s what he would say. So I was like, what? I named them after, you know, like, I and I thought it was so lame after that. And I wanted to be something that was like, you know, that meant oneness or that, you know, that was more singular and that represented a collective. And so I told in a meditation, I was like, alright, guys. I chose a a lane name for you guys, pick something else, and I’m throwing the ball that’s in your court, and I’ll be waiting for that really great name that’s gonna come through. And I went I left the house to take my cat to the vet and all the parking spot were being temporarily blocked by a dumpster that was being delivered to the vet clinic and it was olive green and in big bold white letters it said a team on the side. And I was just like I just left the house like ten minutes before So I was like, what? And it was in that moment that I had the knowing that a does mean singular or one in the English language, and it also infers that we are a team and they need me as much as I need them. So a team just stuck after that.

Victoria Volk: Oh, I love that story. I’m so glad I went there. But it brings up the synchronicities that we experience in life that we really don’t often pay attention to and unless you have like this tuned inness Mhmm. About yourself. You probably will miss a lot of these synchronicities. What do you say to people who want to tune in more and learn who their team is and who their guides are? Like, what are some steps that people can take?

Helen Gretchen Jones: So I have a small group of women who come and sit with me and I co teach with another woman here in my town of Austin. We have a little thing that we kind of put together and we just talked about this. How can we receive signs and synchronicities more clearly because I receive them literally. They come in like there’s no doubt, whereas my friend who’s the medium, who gives me a hard time for not using the word medium. Her name is Keisha.
She doesn’t get them like that. She doesn’t get them like in your face signs, but she has she has a sudden knowing or a feeling of that makes sense when she sees something. For me, I ask for a sign in advance. So it’s gonna be different for different people. For me, I say, okay, guys. I believe I just received a message from me that was pretty clear, but this is a big one and I need validation for this. You guys are gonna need to send me a sign. And then I just take a deep breath and I say, okay, and the sign is gonna be, and I let them place a sign in my head. It’s usually comes through as a thought or an image. I let them pick it because they have a very broader perspective, like a a a bigger vantage point to see what I’m going to be experiencing in the next couple of days based on the choices I’ve made so far and the intentions behind the choices I am currently making.
So they’re gonna place a little something in my mind. So if I chose, for example, I saw a symbol of a rose. Well, it’s not gonna be some random person. It’s gonna come and just hand me a rose on the street. I suppose that could happen.
But more likely, I’m gonna go through Starbucks and the person who’s scanning my app is gonna be named Rose. Or if I go check out something at the grocery store, the person’s gonna have a Rose tattoo on their arm. It’s really not being dismissive of the little things. And when you can be that aware of those subtle synchronicities, Well, spirit gets real excited. They’re like, yes, we got through.
Now, what else can we deliver? What else is she willing to see and recognize as part of, you know, a greater whole of what’s happening around her? My friend, Keisha, She is different. She says, okay, I’m gonna wait for a sign. She doesn’t ask them to tell her what it is. She’s just going to go about her day and all of a sudden she’s gonna feel, I think that’s my sign. I think that’s my knowing that this is validating the information that was coming through earlier. So I think it’s gonna vary by person. I always tell my team I need a huge sign. Don’t make me guess or second guess it. So I look for those very, very literal signs and I get them, which is amazing.

Victoria Volk: So I I’m a Reiki master. I do energy healing work. I work with Grievers. You know, I’m I I should be I feel like I should be more entuned. You know? I I feel like I’ve been frustrated because it’s like I ask for specific signs, but I like how your approach is where you’re just asking for the sign to be given to you. Like, what will be the sign? Yes. I like that approach and because I feel like it’s it’s caused me to feel doubtful of myself. It’s caused me to feel unsure. And so but when I’m in a session with somebody and I’m working with their energy field and that feels very sure to me. You know, at the moment, you know, so that I can’t it’s difficult for me to reconcile, like, the stuff for myself. Like, what what you just talked about, that’s where I’m struggling. And so I like your approach that you shared in how you do that. Mhmm. I might might try that for myself, so thank you for sharing that.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Sure. It was actually taught to me by someone else. By the way, I’m glad it’s working out.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. So let’s change the subject to grief because that’s what whole podcast is about and what your work is about as I’m a death doula too, trained death.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Oh, fantastic. Okay.

Victoria Volk: But I have yet to figure out what that’s gonna look like for me. And so I’m very anxious to hear how you’ve incorporated that into your work and how you support the living as a death doula. Right? So Yes. A lot of questions, a lot of things there. Let’s put a pin in some of those. And hopefully, we don’t forget what we want to talk about now. But so as a child, you mentioned that you very young age, you recognize this gift, but had you had a lot of death in your life and in your family? Around that time when you first discovered this? Was it family that was coming to you who had deceased? Or

Helen Gretchen Jones: It was in some cases, it was my for example, some of my grandmother’s deceased relatives. She had a lot, you know, know, during the Great Depression, there were a lot of people having a lot of kids, and it was a different time back then. So she had lost some of her siblings. And I do remember some of them coming through. So even now, it’s confusing to me when I insist in my memory that they were there for a family event, and they’re like, no, they were deceased. But in my mind, they were there. I think when you’re little, sometimes it’s hard to differentiate. But I didn’t start working with dying people until I didn’t feel the need to, until after twenty fifteen. Twenty fifteen was when my father died. He was young. He was in his fifties. And it was relatively unexpected for the family. It was not unexpected for me, five months before his death, I had been given a vision of his death. And he was he had cirrhosis at the liver that was health related. And I think his death being so unexpected for specifically one of my sisters and for some of his siblings even. There was a lot of closure that didn’t get a chance. There was so much stuff that was left unsaid and there was a lot of hurt and pain that people were holding on to from past actions. And and I thought, gosh, if when I heard about a death duel, I thought if there was any way that I could navigate someone else’s deep loss like that and and help them not have all these things left unsaid. If I could help them to find closure, then that’s what I wanna do. And so that’s what led me down the path of being a death doula. And once I chose, went all in, I committed, this is what I’m gonna do. I’m gonna help the people who are dying and the families. My gifts started to change and evolve towards that. Because before, I was doing more raky and sound bowl and it was a little bit more dealing on an individual basis what that person needed, especially some shock work, things like that. But once I moved into working with people who are dying, my gift started to evolve towards the people who are dying. So it shifted for sure.

Victoria Volk: So when you’re so you work with the people who are dying,

Helen Gretchen Jones: I do, specific. And their families and their families and their family stuff.

Victoria Volk: Okay. What does that look like? I’m just curious for myself personally. Like, what does that look like? Is it, you know, helping them, yeah, I’ll let you explain.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Sure. So it depends on who hires me, or I also do volunteer work. So it’s both of All of that matters based on what you’re working with. So if the family hires me, then usually means that the patient’s a little more close minded to their process that’s coming up for them, their dying process. If it’s the patient that hires me, it’s usually because they feel like the family hasn’t come to terms with what they have come to terms with. And so it really depends on what direction I’m going to be going in, but ultimately you’re working with both family and patient. It has been my experience so far that when the patient first receives a diagnosis of a terminal illness, then you’re they’re gonna be first able to fight it. What can I do to to live longer? How can I keep death at bay? Nobody ever wants to talk about death. It’s such a taboo topic, especially in our western civilization. So we’re looking at it’s unlucky. Oh, don’t say that. Oh, you know, that’s not being positive. That’s being negative. When in reality every single living being has to die. Every plant animal person, it doesn’t matter, cells, molecules, everything transitions to a different state. So instead of focusing on it being a negative thing, a bad thing, a horrible thing. If we were to shift our perspective and really make it about this is what’s happening, now how can we make it the best possible? You know? And yes, we’re all gonna grieve. We’re all going to feel sad about the physical loss of our loved one. Of course, that’s part of the process. Nobody on this planet will not experience that. But knowing that we have to go through it, what’s the best possible way to go through it and how can we heal hearts beforehand so that any of that pain and hurt doesn’t have to continue to shape the lives of those left behind. So that’s really what I’m doing. And that’s on a case by case basis. So sometimes when a purse oh, I guess I go back to what I said. I’m so sorry. I kinda got off topic a little bit. First, we’re really angry, and we try to fix it and keep it at bay. And But once we accept that this is happening, that’s when fear sets in. People feel fearful over the process of dying. And they they then look for a little bit of control. What can I control now? So they start to do their paperwork. They start to I want you to have this, I want you to have that, I want this person to come, I want this, you know, they start to try to control their environment. And then in the last week or two before death, that’s when we start to see some pretty amazing things. We start to see Our loved one who’s dying starts to see people who are coming that have already transitioned. They start to see beings of light. And the reason that this is important and should not be considered something to be medicated or that we need to convince them is not actually happening. The reason this is important is because that removes the fear that people have around death. When they start to have a foot in both worlds, they start to see that they’re not alone, and it’s okay for them not to be fearful of the next space and someone’s coming in and slowly introducing the next phase to them so that they’re comfortable when the time comes. It’s really a really amazing important phase. And in addition to that, it gives the loved ones hope that there is something more.
So All of these phases are really important in the in the dying process. And as a death doula, when you’re there, you’re navigating each individual phase and meeting the person right where they’re at with the ultimate goal of peace.

Victoria Volk: Had a guest. His name is Chris Kerr, and he had written a book. He works with hospice patients. And he had has done a lot of research on the dying process and wrote a book. Death is about a dream, and he had a very interesting take on it. And he was actually part of the Netflix documentary or series surviving death.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Oh.

Victoria Volk: So I’ve had a lot of different types of people on this show. But in your personal experience though with your dad, when you learn that information, like, did you keep it to yourself? Did you share it? Or

Helen Gretchen Jones: So when I my dad’s death was the first close family death because it’s your parent. And when I received that vision, it was my first vision that I’ve received as someone dying. And I journaled it because I was, you know, always journaling and meditating doing doing doing things like that. I told my husband and a neighbor about it, and then I let it go. In the vision, me, my dad was in a hospital bed, And he was his by the way, let me just say, my dad was a good old boy. He lived out on a ranch all alone with his dog. You know, he didn’t want any kind of he wanted to be off the grid. I mean, he was you know. Okay. So he was buried Texan, buried. And so his biggest fear, one time he told me, I found out that he hadn’t told his sister or any of my sisters about it either or his mom or anybody. Was that he feared dying alone and that nobody would find him for days. So when I had my vision and he had die was dying in a hospital, that was an unusual thing for him because, yeah, my dad would not have just gone to the doctor of the hospital. He was out on the land. So he was in the hospital. There was a number five flashing above his head. The hospital walls were this bluish green color, and he he was young still in in that vision. And my daughter who was just a baby. I mean, she was a little at that four or five, I think. And she was holding my hand and she looked to be the same age and I thought he’s gonna be dying soon. So I journaled it he’d been he’d been staying with me in Austin, which is where I’m at, and he he lived down South Texas. And he’d been drinking all day. He kept extending his stay because he couldn’t get behind the wheel to drive. He was watching politics really loud. He was a smoker. My backyard was littered with cigarette butts. He brought his dog. I had cats. It was just kind of a chaotic mess and I didn’t want him to feel unwelcomed, but it was very, very frustrating for me at that time. Of course, I love my dad, but it wasn’t an enjoyable experience, I should say. So by the and that’s when that vision happened. So I was really kind of focused on how can I get my dad to go back home? And this is, you know, really certain that the quality of that of of my family, now my children, my husband, it was I mean, it was a chaotic time. And the holidays were coming. The kids were starting school. I had a lot going on, so I just pushed that vision aside. It was my first vision. How do I know if it’s right? I wrote it down, told a couple of people that was it. Well, five months later, on February fifth of twenty fifteen, all those fives, while he was in his fifties, the whole thing started at five o’clock in the morning. He was in rehab. He’d agreed to go to rehab at Christmas, and he was in rehab, and they found him kind of out of it in his room, took him to a hospital. And that’s the only way he would have ever been in a hospital. And sure enough, we get there. The hospital has blueish green walls, and it’s all unfolding exactly as the vision. And I needed someone to watch my daughter because it was a two hours away and my neighbor called my neighbor said, can you get my daughter for school? And she was like, remember that vision you had? I was like, oh my gosh. She was the one that reminded me about it. And so since then, now that I work with people who are dying, I do get ballparks on on people’s death. Ballparks, not like February fifth at five AM, nothing like that. It’s gonna be it’s just like three weeks. You know, approximately two and a half years. I’ve got one that’s approximately four years. So I do get these ballparks on people now, but that gift is new since I started working with people who are

Victoria Volk: dying. Wow.

Helen Gretchen Jones: But when I first got it, I just wanna share. When I first got it, I thought, am I supposed to stop it? Now I felt this responsibility. Was this but that’s what movies teach you. You know? They’re just like, oh, someone got a vision. They have to go stop. Someone’s No. It’s my belief and that could change, right, based on experiences. I’m always trying to see what what I’m interpreting is correct or not. But it’s my belief that when a soul decides to die, then I’m able to pick up on that wave or that packet of information that’s already out there. When that soul has decided. So while the personality of my dad may not have decided to die, he wouldn’t have wanted that. On a soul level, he did. And so when that soul made that choice, that’s when I was able to receive that information. So I believe someone that is close to me now when I got I was cooking spaghetti and came right over me four years. I’m just like, so on the soul level that person has made the choice even though their personality has not. So, yeah, that’s I hope I answered your question.

Victoria Volk: I feel like I’m in a trance just watching and listening. That’s fascinating. I don’t know how I would feel with that information, like, what do you do with it?

Helen Gretchen Jones: What’s so interesting is his mom, my grandmother, after my dad died, I told her about the vision. And she was like, if you ever get one on me, you better tell me. Most people tell me if you ever get one on me, do not tell me. Right? So shortly after that, I did get one on her. And I I got it in December, and I was like, oh my gosh. Do I tell her, you know, do I I had a real knot in my stomach about it. And she’s a loved one too. She is. She is. And she told me to tell her. And so but I was really struggling with this because at that point, I was believing that by telling someone to you then, is it like, like a Shakespeare play? Are you making it happen? Because now you’re putting it in their their field and it’s gonna You know what I mean? So I was really struggling with what does it mean to have a vision. And so I went ahead and told her and she she did die within two and a half years just like the vision. I think it was eighteen months. I think now I can’t remember what the vision was. I’d have to go back to my journals and look. Was it two years or eighteen? I said maybe eighteen months to twenty four months. I can’t remember now, but she hit the mark. And I was just like you’ve got to be kidding me. Is it because I told her? Is it because And so I struggled with that.
Now though, like I mentioned earlier, I believe it is when a soul decides that’s how I’m It’s not my responsibility

Victoria Volk: Mhmm.

Helen Gretchen Jones: At all. But what it does is allow me to prepare the people around them and that person or their big transition. So what would have been nice had I insisted one of my sisters come with me to family weekend when my dad was in rehab and knowing that my dad had a shortened time and really allow her to express how she was feeling and her hurt and pain and allow him to at least have the opportunity to work through some of that. Same with my grandmother because we knew she got cancer shortly after. We were able to work through that.
She had all of her stuff, her all her ducks in a row, she said everything she wanted to say, everybody said their final good buys because they were expecting it. So I think that’s why I’m given that information now is because on a choice I’ve made to work with people who are dying. So now it’s like, I don’t have to tell anyone what their ballpark is. That’s not the important part. The important part is to allow me to have a time frame in which to work with them or their families bring about the greatest amount of peace for the transition.

Victoria Volk: Full body chills. Let me ask you this. So having this gift as a child and growing into your teens in adulthood, so your perspective of grief is obviously very different from everybody else around you. And you said that, you know, it was like it challenged you to believe your parents and what they were telling you. Like, I believe it happened to you. But, you know, what were the things about grief that you that people were telling you that you didn’t believe and what has your grief with your father and the work that you’re doing, what has that all taught you now?

Helen Gretchen Jones: So I’ll start with my dad and then I’ll talk about my childhood. So my dad’s the grief around my dad was profound and that was I probably was I call it a funk. I wouldn’t say it was a full on depression, but after his death and parents are supposed to go before their kids. I felt like I had a good relationship with my dad. Like, there was no reason for me to feel that way.
But I think I was also processing the grief of the family. The grief of the family was deep, and my grief was profound, but I have to say that his death was the catalyst to me helping other people through their grieving processes. So it’s been a very important of death that has and he comes through, you know, he’s a better communicator in death than he ever was in life. Mhmm. So this has also been a process for him. So even though he has transitioned to a different state, of being his molecules or moving a little different faster rate than ours. I think this has given him the opportunity to move through his process. We don’t just it’s been my experience so far that we don’t just die and suddenly everything’s fixed. Everything is perfect and we’re suddenly all knowing. It’s nothing like that. We have a higher perspective. We have a greater understanding. We recognize how our actions affected those around us. And I think that working with me now, my dad has the opportunity to sort of work through what he feels was maybe causing grief to the people he’d left behind based on his action. This is an opportunity for him to sort of heal some of that with us left behind. And so in that way, my grief and the grief of the family has been very important into serving other people who are working through grief, growing up. And I think that this is not uncommon. I hear it all the time. People who have had challenging upbringings, you know, moved around a lot. Maybe my mom got married a lot, and we lived with our grandmother half the time. And so there was a lot of emotional and mental patterns that needed to be broken, a lot of cycles that needed to be broken through my my mom and her parents and different things like that. So they were dealing with constant grief, regrets, and and challenges on their own, which affected how their children were being raised. Luckily for me, I had my team in spirit who would come in because, you know, in order to get a little bit of peace, I would go sit in an empty bathtub and close the door as a little kid, and that’s where I would find a loan time. And I could just focus on the silence. And it was at that time, sometimes, not every time that my team would come in and they would they would never tell me, you know, they would always tell me everything’s gonna be okay, but they would never tell me what I was seeing or witnessing, but they would suggest other perspectives to help me understand perhaps. The decisions behind my parents and grandparents. And that would help me realize that maybe it isn’t all about me. When when you’re a kid, everything’s about you, you have to be or you wouldn’t survive. Right? So and you start to recognize their own hurt and their pain. And it was maybe more of a gift for me to be able to see that early on because of the suggestions from my team and spirit. But there’s a lot of grief in my family that needed to be worked through. And so I feel like maybe perhaps there’s a lot of just grief that is around me, and so I’m being given an opportunity to help other people find peace in that.

Victoria Volk: I had another guest. She was a medium. That once said that there was a parent that had lost a child and the child had died by suicide. And the child came to the parent through this medium. And she said, you know, told this mother that he’s in school. Like, that’s how he described it. Like, he was in school. And so when you were talking about how your father is, like, he’s through you. Is that right? He’s kinda working through his transgressions as in things that he did maybe to others in the physical plane. Like, it’s his school. Like, that makes me think of that. Is that how it comes to you or how you would describe those on the other side kind of describe it as well?

Helen Gretchen Jones: Yeah. Actually, when you mentioned that, so when I sit with other people for an intuitive reading and their loved ones come through almost every single time, they show me classes. And it’s such an interesting thing because you’re thinking, oh, like, classes, but you that’s literally what it looks like. It looks like classrooms. It looks like gatherings on green lawns. Even like it’s gatherings of people with an instructor or some person who has experience in that one field. So one of the things my dad has shown me would be communication. And working with how to communicate more effectively, how to communicate cross, you know, more I don’t know what that would be, like, from physical to non physical dimensions. People have shown me I have one client whose mom showed me that she was studying the stars. And I know that sounds kind of silly or just like the like astronomy or, you know, like, but yes, apparently there’s some there she’s showing me studying celestial bodies of some sort. And this was an interest that she was kind of moving her soul into that direction for a little while. And I do, I see it as classrooms. But these are not like our classrooms that we have here. They’re just so much more hands on and they’re they feel huge. And they feel connected and they feel just expansive. So, yeah, it’s like a school even over there, classrooms and learning potentials and how awesome is that, or we’d get so crazy bored just playing a harp on the cloud somewhere.

Victoria Volk: So what do you think is the most frustrating in your experience that people who are trying to communicate with us on the physical plane? What what are the frustrations that you receive?

Helen Gretchen Jones: That people in spirit are having?

Victoria Volk: Yeah.

Helen Gretchen Jones: That we’re dismissive, that we dismiss signs, that we don’t allow. There’s okay. Well, here’s another thing. That we don’t allow. We dismiss imagination as make believe instead of allowing our imaginations. Like, we’re here as humans on this planet. We came here to experience this physical reality And part of the best thing about being human is we get to create and co create our experience on this planet. That is like like, that’s like the best part about being here. So your your mindset, your thoughts, your perspective, your choices, your everything is co creating your experience here. So in order for that to happen, you have to come up with an idea or set an intention or imagine it. But when you we have the setup thing that imagination is pretend and it’s not thoughts create things. They create worlds. So when you’re sitting here wanting to connect to spirit and you’re imagining sitting on a park bench in New York or whatever you want to do through a guided hypnosis or meditation, and you say, okay, I like a loved one or one of my guides to come sit next to me on this bench and then they do and then they give you a message and you’re like, that’s nice, but I imagined all of that because I wanted it and I created it and we dismiss the cocreation with spirit. Spirit’s like great. She’s setting up a bench in New York for me to come sit on. I’m gonna do it and now she’s gonna dismiss it because she thinks she’s completely imagining it instead of reframing imagination instead of his make believe but calling it co creation with Spirit.

Victoria Volk: I love that. I love that. Got it. Maybe you think of something else and then it slipped my mind now. Maybe you know what it was.

Helen Gretchen Jones: I just I just I I hope that anyone who hears this would consider doing a guided meditation or a hypnosis session, whatever works best for you. And to realize that all these words that we put on it, like, it’s a hypnosis session, it’s a, you know, raky event, which is, you know, an energy healing, doesn’t matter what you call it. It’s what the intention you place behind it. Words can be just semantics because once we put a label on something, we limit it, you know, anyway. So just know that you’re here creating this world And if you choose to connect to your team and spirit or to god or to angels or whoever, then do it and don’t dismiss it, write it down. And you’ll start to recognize that discernment will strengthen. You’ll start to be able to interpret messages more strongly. And less through the filter of your human mind. It’s a fantastic way to connect.

Victoria Volk: So how can we connect to our team? How do we know who our team is? How do you

Helen Gretchen Jones: think about that?

Victoria Volk: Who is your team?

Helen Gretchen Jones: So okay. So my team is a very large collective, and it’s a group of, you know, angelics, ascended masters, ancestors, alternate dimensional beings, aliens, like it doesn’t matter. It’s whatever physical body you wanna put them in, it doesn’t matter. But for me, I like having a physical archetype body that can step forward in my thoughts as a way of connecting. So there’s a few that have come through pretty regularly more than Sometimes I’ll just see one one time and that’s it. But I have one whose name is LIRA. I heard her name LIRA or LIRA LIRA LIRA and she always comes through as this blue light. So sometimes she looks elderly, sometimes she looks young, but she’s blue. I was like, okay, I just focused one night on meeting one of them, and she was the first one that comes through and I’m like, okay, well, I’m gonna need sign this week. I’m gonna need to hear your name three times for me to know if that’s really your name and that’s gonna be something I can all week long. That’s what I’m gonna need. And it happened. So I had a friend come up and talk to me. Guess what I just learned about the constellations. There’s constellation. They mentioned the Leerink constellation or, you know, something like that. And I was like, I didn’t really need to hear that whole conversation about the constellations, but it was important that I heard that name mentioned. Then there was another someone said, hey, I’m sending you an audiobook you need to listen to was my neighbor. And the opening credits was talking about someone named LIRA. And I was just like, oh, okay. There’s never I didn’t even read the book. I only think I needed to hear the opening credits. And then a third person was I was having a session done, and she goes, you have a guy named LIRA. So I know that now that’s like an actual intuitive coming in. And but it was and I was like, I do. And you’re the third third validation. And then another one, and this is a strange one. It’s a guy named kissinger. K? I only know of one kissinger, and he’s still alive, and he’s a political figure. And but that was the name that I heard. And I was like, okay. That is so lame. Like, I even looked at what kissinger meant, and it’s like farm or bOG or something. It wasn’t something that meant like, you know, I don’t even know what I was looking for, but kissinger was not it. But I was like, alright, guys, three times you know the rule. Right? Well, I got it three times in one night. I had gone before bed, I’d gone to Barnes and Noble’s. And apparently, there was a right when he walked in a whole display.
I guess, kissinger had done a book or something fairly, like, in the last seven or eight years or something. And there was a display right when I walked in. I wasn’t even gonna go to Barnes and Noble’s. It was right by Old Navy, and I just swung by because I had some extra time to kill. Okay. So anyway, so there it was. Okay. And then I go home, I’m like, fine. Okay. I go home. I literally lay down in bed and just turn on the TV person that pops up is a is a documentary on. Kissinger. I was like, that’s two, you guys. And then my husband and I run a photography rental business. I’m I’m in the studio now. And somebody texted me, hey, do you have this and this and this equipment? And one of the words was kissinger. And they said, that’s so weird. It corrected. Auto corrected it. I meant the word to be profoto, which is nowhere near the word kissinger. Yeah. So I was like, that was my third one. So I got kissinger all in one day. So I’m like, okay.
I called one of my guys kissinger. So anyway,

Victoria Volk: that’s very unique names too, by the way. Like, very unique, like, LIRA and kissinger. Like, under so weird. You know.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Right. But I asked for validation, and I said I needed to hear it three times in the week. And then I didn’t start trying to connect to an individual guide until the other one was confirmed. So that’s how I did it. And there are people I frequently see people’s guides, and so I can connect people to their guides. And I have several people who are intuitive to do the same thing with guides. But my thought is to come up with your own name. You can call them whatever you want. Call them Frank. And then they will make sure Frank is validated three times because they don’t care what you call them. The most important thing is that you’re willing to connect to them and that you interpret their message and their messages are always beautiful.

Victoria Volk: So is your dad part of the a team? Or is he just kind of a special guy that just that you choose when you connect to? Or is he kind of like, no, I wanna connect with you now. This is we would need to have this conversation now.

Helen Gretchen Jones: That’s really interesting. And I would be I would love to hear other people’s feedback on their experience around this. I have found that when people transition, they’re really loud and clear and available very frequently the first year. Then after that, it’s like they’re kinda like, alright, I’m ready to go start my own class, my own stuff, you know, which I know time isn’t linear over there. So at least I understand that to be the case. So in that, why is it a year? It just seems to be that people tend maybe because weren’t they don’t they’re not needed as much. That first year after someone dies, we’re constantly reaching out to them on a heart level, you know, grieving them. And so maybe that’s why they’re around so much. So if my dad pops in, I call them a part of a team, but he’s he comes and goes. I have some that are more static. But for the most case, a lot of my collective that’s why I like to call them a collective is because they’re not they come and go as as as I need.

Victoria Volk: Just this morning, I was watching the news and Well, last night, there was the Dodgers and Yankee’s game. And so on the news this morning, it was all about the Dodgers player. And I don’t know all the names. I don’t even remember, but it and it doesn’t matter. I wanna speak to the synchronicity of it.
And I was just, like, sitting there, like, And I’m wondering if anybody else is watching this like, wow, that is really crazy and synchronistic. But I picked up on it. It’s the the dodger that he hit a grand slam home run run through like last night. First time in is it the first time in World Series history? I’m not sure. I don’t think so. Because the last time it happened, I think, was another dodger. However, many years ago, many, many years ago, who had a limp leg just like this dodger. And it happened at I can’t even remember the time right now. I should have written it down, but it was, like, a minute, within a minute apart.
The grand slam, like, both of them. Like,

Helen Gretchen Jones: this domestic.

Victoria Volk: And it was like and I don’t know if the other dodger is passed on by now. I I would assume he has. I’m not even sure. I’m gonna have to go down rabbit hole on that. But it just was fascinating to me. Like, there there is something about that that just caught my attention. You know?

Helen Gretchen Jones: I think if it catches your attention, then you should go down that rabbit hole a little bit because I think that plays into your general awareness of synchronicities. And so maybe someone’s trying to get your attention as well.

Victoria Volk: That could be interesting. So have you gotten a ballpark on yourself?

Helen Gretchen Jones: I have not. That’s a really good question. But when I sit down to do meditations, they tell me that this is a short life. This is a they always say, dear one, young one, something like that. They Dear child, whatever.
They But they tell me that this is a short life for me. So I either have to acknowledge that it’s a short life because I’m human. And this relatively speaking is a short life, or I could go tomorrow. So knowing that this is a short life and that perhaps on a soul level, maybe I’ve already made that choice and I’m not aware of it. Yeah. I mean, it could happen. I can get diagnosed next year, like who knows tomorrow? I don’t know. So I I try to live each day in the flow. I ask myself, am I in the flow of where I wanna be right now? What is the most exciting thing that’s lined up for my day? That’s what I’m gonna choose first. And so, like, if you’re at home, like, I got to have a day, I think, last Thursday, which was housecleaning day, that sounds kind of lame, but gosh, I feel good when it’s done. And so I just kind of looked at all the chores which one do I wanna do first? Which one excites me the most? You know? And I would just do that one first. It doesn’t have to be like you’re always going to the club or, you know, doing something profound like writing a book or reaching out at a seminar. It didn’t have to be that way to seek excitement your day. For me, laundry was the least exciting thing it got saved at the end. But but what was most exciting was for me, unloading the dishwasher and loading it. That was the first thing I started with. So it can be even the little thing. So if I find that I’m in the flow of life, that sort of dictates where I’m going because I do believe my life here will be short.

Victoria Volk: So how have you utilize this gift in your life personally? Through personal endeavors, careers, relationships, and how has that shifted from probably your teen years? Well, even maybe young adult years to to now.

Helen Gretchen Jones: So it shifted a lot actually, but I’m going to give a lot of credit to my team and spirit, or I’m going to give credit to myself for being open to the teachings from my team and spirit. I can say that as well because it’s easy to dismiss. That can be subtle sometimes. But when you’re first born and you’re a kid and you’re a teenager, you are so self centered. You have to be for survival. You are recognizing the patterns of your family. You’re looking to see how you can fit in the most how you could stay out of trouble the most, you know, what what lies is an okay thing to do and not everything is based on observing your surroundings, changing your self to fit in both at school and at home and on every level. And all of that is part of the growing up process and trying to figure out who you are in this big old jumble of personalities. So it wasn’t until I was a young adult doing everything I thought I was supposed to be doing. Because what everybody else told me I should do, which was, you know, graduate high school, go to college, get married, have kids. I mean, it’s just kinda like you do what you’re told, what everybody else’s dreams are. And if something happens in your early adulthood, where you start to recognize that you’re different than how you’ve maybe allowed yourself to be this whole time. And my team and spirit, that’s when they started coming around when I was in my early twenties and trying to really force compassion. And compassion is something that’s really hard to have unless it’s like a beloved person or animal that you’ve lost in childhood because you are so self centered and you have to be in order to survive and thrive. So when my team started pushing compassion, they would say, put yourself in their shoes, but not how you would do things differently, not how you would change it, not what you would have done to fix it, or what you could do to fix it just be. Just be in their shoes and experience what they’re experiencing. And that quickly takes you out of that me me me mindset. You know? And so I think that was important to moving me through upcoming grief understanding other people’s grief and having sympathy for that and helping me to navigate who I am as a person and be more understanding to who everybody else is and less judgmental because man, it’s easy to judge others because you always think you have the I wouldn’t have done that. I wouldn’t have done something differently, but that is the mindset of someone who is twenty five and younger. No. But it’s time to move past that when you’re no longer a child. And you can make your own choices and it’s important to consider how you fit in the other part of this world without having to compromise who you are.

Victoria Volk: Would you say that as a child and as an adult, you as a person are an empath or highly sensitive because I I always thought they were kind of the same, but they’re not, like in a highly sensitive person isn’t necessarily an empath, but an empath is always highly sensitive is what I’ve learned. What are your thoughts around that? And I think as a child for me personally, and because when I was listening to you speak, that was something I think that came natural to me. Like, I felt everybody’s stuff so much. Almost too much. I didn’t know what to do with it. I had to I lost my father when I was eight. My grandmother the year before that, there was just a lot of stuff and chaos in my life. And so it was like I needed a lot of sleep. It was like a curse to me. It was really was a curse. And so what what would you say to that? Like, what was your experience around that? And, you know, would you consider yourself an empath?

Helen Gretchen Jones: I wouldn’t have my sister was extremely empathic and sensitive. I would say she still is. And like you, she slept a lot. She couldn’t it made life feel so overwhelming sometimes for her, and she’s still very much that way. And she kind of scooby doo’s. That’s what I call it when you’re just kind of running in one spot, but don’t go anywhere. You know, you’re kinda like in a rut a little bit. So she has a tendency to do that based on her feelings and the feelings of everybody else around her can be so overwhelming. She’s extremely sensitive in that way. I was more walls up, put up walls, put up shielding and really kept myself from being overly involved because I couldn’t trust. I couldn’t trust that we weren’t gonna be moving tomorrow. I couldn’t trust that the person that my mom recently married is gonna staying around. And so I never allowed myself to indulge in the feelings of other people and hardly let myself do it for myself, you know. And so luckily allowing my team to come in and help me better understand the perspectives of why choices were being made when I couldn’t understand, kept me from some of that. Also, I don’t know, but I wonder if having a sibling who I was close to and living with, who was processing everybody else’s emotions along with hers. If that gave me the grace to not have to. And I think that frequently with healers, I find that many of them are sensitive and empathic because they are able to clear other people’s energy by kind of processing it through themselves also. When they don’t know how to move it without processing it when they’re early on. And I think my sister’s probably a healer who doesn’t do anything with it because it she’s so kind of overwhelmed by her stuff. I’m more of a teacher. And while I think everyone’s a teacher and a student, I think that you’re not always a healer if you’re a teacher, and you’re not always teaching if you’re a healer, but you can.

Victoria Volk: I love that. Yeah. And that’s where energy healing you know, I have I heard Ricky three times.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Oh, and you’re like, that’s what I’m doing.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. I I’m gonna look go down that rabbit hole. Yeah. It’s been a series of rabbit holes in the last, probably, six years. And the exponential growth I’ve had because of it of being open to hearing things repeatedly or going down these rabbit holes. And I always think of it as like this download or intuitive thought or curiosity that, like, drops in and then I follow it. And that’s just how it has appeared to me, but it’s never been, like, this direct it hasn’t felt like a direct communication. I think that’s what’s lacking for me. And that’s where my frustration is.

Helen Gretchen Jones: I mean, that’s pretty direct to hear Ricky three times. How does he do it?

Victoria Volk: That is that I guess I want more of it. You know, I want to be able to utilize that openness for myself as much as I’ve utilized it for other people. And I think that’s kind of I think I’m at the point where it’s like, okay, I want this from my own self. I want You know what I mean?

Helen Gretchen Jones: Because I didn’t

Victoria Volk: grew up as being an emotional caretaker for everybody else, and I’ve always often been that. And so now it’s like, alright, let’s go. I want I want I

Helen Gretchen Jones: that’s so funny.

Victoria Volk: I mean,

Helen Gretchen Jones: Do you have siblings?

Victoria Volk: I do. I’m the youngest.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Do you feel like I’m just curious now. And do you feel like you were more sensitive than the rest of them? Yes. Do you feel like you possibly processed some of the family’s emotions through some of those challenges and trying times, whereas they didn’t have to because you were doing it for them.

Victoria Volk: I never thought of it that way, but

Helen Gretchen Jones: some didn’t think about it. I don’t know. I feel like my sister may have done that for me and unknowingly, and I hadn’t thought about it till today. Actually, but I feel like that’s maybe something that happened.

Victoria Volk: Why else can we go with this? Because I I could talk all day. Are you how are you on time?

Helen Gretchen Jones: I’m good. I’m good. We’re just I don’t know. We’re just kinda going back and forth.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. I feel like we’re talking about a lot of different things. I have a series of questions that I have on my form, and I do wanna get to I wanna I wanna ask these because I feel like I want my listeners to get what they need to receive to from this. And from your experience of your own growth in grief, in working with others, in theirs. What would you what would be the piece of advice? And you you’ve shared a lot, but what is one thing that you were feeling guided to share in terms of I just received this diagnosis or my loved one just received this diagnosis or the flip side of that, there was no warning at all. What is the approach that you would suggest for both of those scenarios? I don’t even know what the question is. Really, what do you wanna say about that? Because it’s like, how do you connect in those circumstances? I don’t even know what the question is. So however you interpret me at I don’t know. I don’t even know what I’m saying anymore.

Helen Gretchen Jones: So here’s how I would interpret that. If someone is given a diagnosis and they’re like you’re it has spread everywhere you’ve literally got weeks, that’s a very scary thing. And if there’s someone out there who has a family member or the they’re themselves have they’ve just been given that diagnosis or that prognosis, then I would suggest with everything that you are to open up that bag and just say I’m going to just for one week allow myself to do this and I’m going to I’m going to say the things that I need never said, that needed to be said. And I’m even if it’s hurtful, I’m gonna say it in the kindest way possible. And I’m going to clear the air. And a lot of people find that it’s really hard to do that because they don’t want to say it to someone who is dying. They’re about to die anyway. You know what I mean? That’s what they say. They’re about to die anyway.
Why would I hurt them? They don’t have much time left? It isn’t about hurting. It’s about processing those emotions beforehand. And in my experience, whenever someone has been giving it any kind of diagnosis, whether they have months or weeks or less than that, when they allow themselves to say what they really need to say or they allow themselves to hear what hasn’t been said yet. It’s like a wait is lifted. It hurts in the moment because there’s some regrets usually around that, but quite honestly, There’s regrets around it because it’s been hurting for a long time. And it’s being pushed down and pushed down and people think that they ignore it, it’ll just eventually, you know, smooth itself out. It doesn’t. It lingers. But once they say it, it’s like They can exhale, they can breathe again, and it’s sort of like giving permission to the person who’s dying to go, that when they do die, it’s okay. I used to think that when I was there helping these families who are really navigating hurt and pain and resentment through their grief and loss, then I needed to be the strong one. And so I I thought I needed to not cry. And I needed to hold it all in and push it down and be the strong one like I’m some kind of amazing emotional person that could just process this and then everybody just, you know, I can just direct how everyone else needs to behave. But I found that one time I couldn’t do it and I broke down and I cried. I I couldn’t. I loved this person they were with me for a long time. And I broke down and I cried. And when I did, it’s like it was permission for everybody else. The family broke down and cried. And we think that we have to hold it all together. I mean, just imagine that holding it all together is so so much resistance. There’s tightness. There’s there’s no flow in it. But when you let it go and you let go of whatever you think people are gonna think about you for crying, for being vulnerable, for being open, it never works that way. People actually open up and become vulnerable themselves. And these people cry, they release whatever that pent up stuff is, that energy, and it makes it easier for them to say the things kindly that they always wanted to say. And so if you allow yourself to be authentically vulnerable, in those moments. That’s where you can flow through the grief, the hurt, and the pain in the resentment, no matter how much time this person has left. And I encourage everyone to allow themselves even if it’s just one day. Today is my vulnerable day. That’s what I would suggest.

Victoria Volk: And what about for those who didn’t have that opportunity?

Helen Gretchen Jones: Like my sister, one of my sisters. So for people who didn’t have that opportunity, if they’re okay. So this has happened or with with many of my clients actually, people who refuse to come in with the rest of the family, this this has happened before. And first, I would take into account what their religious and faith based belief systems are. So unless they’re atheist, including agnostics, they’ve leaving something, they just don’t know what it is. So unless they’re atheist, every faith based belief system believes that there is something more after death. Some know what it is, some don’t. K? That’s their belief. So I would navigate the grief through their belief systems. So if someone believes that there is an afterlife, then we start there. We start with this is not the final goodbye. We know that there’s something more. Years what you missed bedside, oftentimes there’s some spiritual experiences with beings of light, angelics, whatever it is. I would teach that oftentimes our loved ones will come in dreams and to be open and available to that. Depending on the person that I’m working with, I would also suggest a medium. And I know this is a nontraditional approach, but there are some pretty fantastic certified triple blind tested through university studies and there’s lists of these people. It’s a short list, you know, but, I mean, maybe a hundred, but they’re out there. These people are so phenomenal. And you get on their waitlist. There’s usually waitlist that could be six months, it could be a year, but here’s what I know. You’re gonna have to go through that six months or that year anyway. And all of a sudden, this opening shows up at the right time when you need it the most and sometimes there’s cancellations to move up the list, whatever. But you put yourself on that list and all of my experiences. And I know this sounds to say all, but I mean all of the people that I’ve worked with who have also worked with a medium. Say that the medium was able to bring them more closure, more more joy, more hope, and more connection than months with a therapist. So and I’m not there’s a place for therapy of absolutely especially processing your emotions through the physical body, it’s very, very important. But having that connection with your loved one and spirit authenticated and validated and being able to feel like they’re right here with you once again because they are and there are people out there who can perceive those energies. It’s very very healing, and it really moves you through that grief process, a little more lighthearted and a little bit more expansive than you were going into it.

Victoria Volk: What about those? Because you you kind of interpreted it as like someone who didn’t come into the room? But what if they’re in an event of an accident where nobody had where there wasn’t a chance, there wasn’t a diagnosis. It was very sudden,

Helen Gretchen Jones: like an accident. In that case, I would recommend the same thing. I would say, there’s so much healing. I know you probably know this, but if there’s anyone who hasn’t ever seen a medium, a really good medium, and I know that there are scammers out there, but there are scammers in every field. There are really bad doctors. There are really bad lawyers. There are really bad salesman and businessman. And there there’s going to be people who take advantage of people in all every field of work in industry. However, there are some really good ones out there who are on amazing websites that can really get you involved. There’s a Actually, this is kind of important to share. It’s a healing thing. There is a website, an organization called helping parents heal. Have you ever heard of them?

Victoria Volk: I have not.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Okay. Helping parents heal. It’s for people who have lost children. And it doesn’t matter the age of your child. But they have incredible gatherings. They have they’ve even done little branch off groups for fathers who have lost mothers who have lost siblings who have lost these people who are processing the grief of losing a child. And they bring in these big events that are just for helping parents heal families and they bring in mediums, the certified authenticated mediums who do group readings for these people and all of them say, my child was there. They knew things about my child that, you know, and then they tell you what the child’s doing now. And, you know, you get these experiences are often validated by the children in spirit. If you’re open to those signs, you know.
So it’s some of the most beautiful experiences, but they have a website with a list of mediums. So if anyone’s out there interested, I know I’m pushing the medium route, but I can tell you I know how non traditional it is, but how healing and processing that grief it can be. Even for people in accidents.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. I’ve heard that myself from people who’ve experienced mediums too. Yes. So you have this gift. Certainly, it helped you process your grief.
But what were some of the other ways and things that you discovered that helped you and worked for you, spirit guides aside? And maybe they probably actually came in and said, hey, you need to do this or you need to do that or this might help you or

Helen Gretchen Jones: Yes. And I do have some things that I do that are self care that help me move through grief because when you’re working as a death doula, you grieve the loss of the people that you formed connections with. I had one patient. I had he was on hospice for five years and I worked with him for four of them. I loved him deeply.
So you do. You do process a lot of grief as a death doula. And it’s kind of hard for the course, really. One thing that really helps me process that grief, and I don’t know what it is, but submerging myself in water, so like a bath. It’s like the field or the energy field around me. It’s like when everything gets submerged, it’s like it stops crackling or it stops. It’s like it all those little molecules or something. I don’t even know because I don’t know science. So I majored in art and religion. So it just all it’s like it somehow thizzles everything out. So for me, it’s submerging in water and that really, and it resets me, it grounds me, and it sort of helps me to take a breath, reevaluate where I am in this very present moment and recognize that everything is okay in this moment. It doesn’t take away my grief. But it certainly helps me to feel more in my body, grounded, and just present. And that helps. Another thing that I find is really really helpful is when I feel it in my body almost like anxiety like they’re too much moving through me is to move my body.
So I go on a brisk walk because if I run, I will I’m, you know, I’m not that fit. So I don’t need to be running, but I do a brisk walk or something and it feels like it shakes it out of me. And that’s really helpful too. So I encourage anyone to physically move. I don’t do this, but I’ve had several people say that this has been very helpful for them. And it’s something called, I’m a get I hope I’m getting it right, a screen pillow. It’s a pillow that they scream into. It’s like they put it over their face, like they’re smothering themselves, and they just scream, and they let it all out, and they have to do it a few times, and that’s sort of like purging that energy that’s been pent up through that kind of throat and solar plexus area of the body where it can feel like you’ve got knots through this grief. You know, how do we get it out you know, and so sometimes screaming is like a level of communication because you’re using your voice, but it’s a way of moving that energy out. I haven’t tried it, but I’ve heard good things about the screen pillow.

Victoria Volk: Well, I think, you know, in terms of anger, it’s very effective, probably, and safe, and non harming. Right. I recommend, you know, why not? You have nothing to lose. It’s worth a try. Actually, I found myself just doing that not that long ago. So, you know, when you’re

Helen Gretchen Jones: with the

Victoria Volk: yeah. When you’re angry, I mean, yeah. You know, even if it’s a cuss word, you know, which may or may not have been my the case for myself.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Like, password or two.

Victoria Volk: Just see what you gotta do. Right? No. That’s a great actually, that has never been suggested in the podcast. So

Helen Gretchen Jones: I will say one more thing. For me, one thing that really really like resets me and this sounds I’m sure cliche or cheesy, but it’s when I go outside and there’s a breeze. Feeling the breeze I close my eyes. I don’t know what it is about a breeze, but it’s like it’s carrying away things.

Victoria Volk: If you can set that intention. Right? Yeah. Set that intention. Yeah.

Helen Gretchen Jones: When the breeze really resets me, I’d love a good breeze.

Victoria Volk: Come to North Dakota, we got plenty of that.

Helen Gretchen Jones: I love

Victoria Volk: it. Flat, and there’s nothing but wind.

Helen Gretchen Jones: That’s good.

Victoria Volk: So you have written a book which we have not talked about yet, healing whispers from spirit guides. And you didn’t even mention it in your bio, which have found interesting. Oh, oh,

Helen Gretchen Jones: you know, that’s how interesting.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. So when did this book come about? And What was the intuitive hit or inspired hit or the guidance that you received around that?

Helen Gretchen Jones: So it was June three years ago, and I woke up and then it was kissinger actually who we talked about already. Normally, when I hear my team in spirit, I hear them inside my head so very subjectively. This time, Kay came across very objectively. I felt like it was right in front of my face. And he said, you’re going to write a book. And I have never had an interest in writing a book. I can’t imagine I am a mom. You know, my I helped my husband with the family business like I seemed so incredibly normal that I didn’t feel like I had anything interesting or valuable to say. And I was like, well, what would I even write about? And they said, write what you know? And it would take you about two and a half years to complete. I took they said two years to complete, it took two and a half. Ballpark. So I started to think about what is it that I know. I know a little but a lot of things, but I didn’t feel like I was an expert in any specific area. And then it did occur to me that I had all these journals. I had all these journals that I’ve been journaling every single time I went to go visit a patient. I talked about what they were going through, what their families were going through, and then I would journal there, when I would be there, when they were dying, and the shared death experiences that I had. So I get to go part way in the spirit world with them. And I journaled these synchronicities and these teachings where my team and spirit would come in and say this is what he’s experiencing, this is what the doctors are saying, and this is what’s actually happening. And so I have these really great journals, and I just referred to those, picked out a few of my favorite patient stories, put him in the book, and then I preceded each patient’s story with a what I learned through the grieving process, through the healing process, what I’ve learned working with Spirit. One one of the chapters is called signs and synchronicities. Right? So what to look force that you understand when knowing that you don’t have to be bedside when someone dies, you can be in a whole another part of the world. Time and space does not matter in these moments. So all these teachings followed by a patient chapter and I end every single chapter with a a channel message from my team and spirit. Usually, it’s kind of beautiful message that they that were already in these journals, actually, that I’ve been put together with these chapters. So so, yeah, it’s it’s It’s just, I think, a book that talks about healing and grieving and the dying process and and how beautiful it can be.

Victoria Volk: And I’ll put the link to that and the show notes, of course. Yeah. What is one of the stories that has touched you the most and has really just stuck with you.

Helen Gretchen Jones: I’m trying to how do I pick one? I guess I’m gonna talk about mister Rob Robinson. Of course, I’ve changed their names for their privacy with the HIPAA acts and stuff. But mister Robinson was an older man. He was put in a nursing home. He had failure to thrive. He was very, very skinny, and he was on oxygen. And did not wanna talk to me. I was like, he was he was very grouchy. But I insisted I showed up every time when I would sit with him.

Victoria Volk: as a volunteer.

Helen Gretchen Jones: I was a volunteer. Yes. His family actually asked for a volunteer through hospice, and he didn’t want one. And so I was volunteering through hospice at this time. And he all he wanted to talk about was his very minimal but still important contribution scientifically in engineering wise to a specific car part. Okay? So, I mean, he was very much caught in because he was so worried about what am I leaving behind. What has my life amounted to. This is where he he didn’t family. He has a couple of kids, but they were living their life with their kids. They weren’t coming to visit very much. And he felt alone and he was trying to figure out what was the point of all this. And so we started just him and I. We were we would work talking about how great it was that he had his discovery But what do you think is most important now? We kind of really worked around that. And eventually and it took a couple of months actually. He said, you know, one thing that I really missed out on is I didn’t travel until I was after age sixty five. And I was told that you do and as we all were told, right, probably growing up, that that’s what you do. You work really hard. You get a good job.
And then at sixty five, you retire, and you travel, and you do all the things that you really wanna do, and you golf, or whatever it is. And that’s what he said he did. And he said, but shortly after sixty five, I my health vaded. And I couldn’t go do all the things. I always knew I was going to do because I wasn’t capable of, you know, walking that. I couldn’t hike anything anymore or my knees or, you know, whatever it was. He had all these ailments. And he’s like, I really feel like I missed out on the good parts of life. And then he said, he would tell me about how his children were sort of problems, how they had all these problems. He doesn’t know how they’re gonna get out of their problems. There was all these different problems. Children were having that in his perception. And then I would say, why are those problems? And I would say, tell me, what’s so wrong with that choice? What’s so and we would negotiate sort of through those stories? And then when I would say something mister Robinson wouldn’t like he would pretend to fall asleep. He would all of a sudden I mean, he would just check out, and that was it. That that’s how he ended our our conversations all the time. That was, like, nope, done, honestly. Well, one time I came in and his daughter was there. And we Mr. Robinson and I’ve been really working through how it was important to share how you’re feeling with your family when they’re here and he’s like not gonna happen, not not gonna do it. But I guess something got through because I walked in and his daughter was crying and he was asleep. I don’t believe he was really asleep. Think that’s how he ended the conversation with his daughter. He’d take to sleep. He basically she had recorded the whole thing. He said she said I had never had a conversation with my dad like this before. It was the most healing experience, and she’s like, I can’t She goes, everything’s okay now. Basically, he told her that he loved her so much, that she’s doing such a good job as a parent, and he recognizes now that he lived his life based on how society wanted him to be a dad, how society wanted him to provide, how society wanted him to he he realized that he didn’t he made choices based on what he believed society wanted him to to live like, and he didn’t want that for her. And that she was more free spirited. And, you know, I guess, she’d had children with multiple dads and she never went to college. These are things that really bothered him. And he’s like, now I see you’re a free spirit and you’re finding love where love is. And you’re a good mom. And so he said, all these amazing things that she really needed to hear. And he said, you know, he was atheist because he’s a scientist. He said, you know, but I do believe there must be a God because he brought me you and I can’t believe that he would bring me one of the most joyful people in my life and then take take her away from me and say I could never see her again. So I know I’m gonna see you again and so all of these beautiful things. So working with someone right where they are. Not telling them they’re wrong, not just giving them suggestions and letting them process that information on their own was enough to give her closure, to give him closure, and for them to both leave feeling that there was hope that they were connected, that there was love, and that there was so much more than what their physical eyes could perceive.

Victoria Volk: And if that full body kills, it reminds me of my own story of going to see my uncle. I hadn’t seen him. He was the only living well, he was very close to my dad. And when my dad died, he, you know, he said that he was gonna take care of us and watch over us. Well, apparently, he didn’t. And that was a really strong resentment towards him from my mother and and, you know, we were told these stories growing up. And so my dad’s family pretty much were not in my life after he passed, and my uncle wasn’t either. And my mother I was in the writing phase of my book and her the editing phase, and my mother had called me and said that he had terminal brain cancer. And I decided that same day that I’m gonna go see him. It had been almost pretty close to thirty years to the day. And I went to go see him and we had about six months of reconnection and it transformed, I think, both of us for both of us, it was transforming because he hadn’t seen me since my dad’s funeral. I hadn’t seen him. And I just felt like I had to do it for him. Like I had to go for him. Unbeknownst to me, it was actually very healing for me too. Yeah. You know. So it reminds me of that, you know, of of how really truly healing it can be to just set aside whatever stories Yes. We’re told and whatever stories that we’ve been led to believe. That you can

Helen Gretchen Jones: or that we’ve created,

Victoria Volk: yeah, or that we’ve created, and that you can choose a different story at any moment.

Helen Gretchen Jones: And if you can just be brave enough to just take that step and do it, and vulnerable, brave and vulnerable. And it’s the hardest part is leading up to it. Once you’re there and you actually do it, things unfold so beautifully usually.

Victoria Volk: Yeah, I knocked on the door. I didn’t know he’d bring cancer. Was he gonna remember me? Did he wanna see me? I had no idea.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Wow,

Victoria Volk: but I didn’t care. It was like this mission that was given to me, you know. It was like I had to be there. And within ten minutes, my two cousins knocked on the door and came in. Who I hadn’t seen either in just as much time.
One from Connecticut, like states across the country, you know. So it was really crazy how that all came to be and turned out, but Yeah. That reminded me of that.

Helen Gretchen Jones: How did your mom take that? Can I ask?

Victoria Volk: Not very well, actually. My siblings didn’t either. And then my sister actually ended up going to see him herself Or, yeah, she went to see him herself and she did not have the same experience. And, you know, I was just like, well, you know, my intention was maybe different than yours You know? I don’t know.

Helen Gretchen Jones: But then if you were open to change and connection.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. Even my book that wasn’t received very well either by my mother, but Fortunately for me, like doing the grief work for myself, like going through grief recovery and doing a lot of personal work, I’ve changed that story. You know, I’ve been able to rewrite that story. And I feel like my mom’s eighty two, she could go at any time. Right? I feel like because of the work that I’ve done, I feel like in just the personal knowing that I have about what the importance of end of life. Right? Like, having conversations on this podcast in particular too have have been healing for me just to understand that whatever I need to say I can there is a way to work through it without having that conversation, but there is also a lot of healing that can happen when you have that conversation with the other that can happen for them.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Yes. Right?

Victoria Volk: And it’s saying we’re all connected. Yeah. It’s discerning what’s mine and what’s theirs and what is meant to be shared Yes. That can be healing for both. Yeah. So how do you discern that? Like, do you share everything that comes through? Or is it Yeah. Probably not.

Helen Gretchen Jones: No. I want to. I’m excited about messages that come through, and I am always eager to have them validated. And I can be a little impatient. But as people can be, I suppose. But I don’t share everything that comes through at all. I do try to write everything down. And the reason I don’t share is because I think sometimes the information is more for me to guide, yeah, because you can tell someone something all you want, you can teach them and and preach to them all you want about a specific thing. But instead, if I were to take that information and suggest come around the edges a little bit, and then they have their own aha moment and they come to that on their own. Oh, that’s what’s healing. That’s what sticks. So you can, you know, say whatever you want to someone, but all you have to do. So I think when the information comes in, I’ll sort of come about it in a roundabout way so that they come up with the idea or they process that information without me having to say aha. But once they do, then it’s validating for me. And I don’t have to say, oh, it was validated for me because it isn’t about me. Mhmm. But it does tell me that I’m on the right path when that information is validated and that I’m doing something for them or I’m helping them come to terms on their own. Because I know I as a healer, I’m sure you know, you can’t heal someone, but you can start the process of having of having them heal themselves. You can be that catalyst for them, but you you can’t heal someone who doesn’t wanna be healed.

Victoria Volk: That’s me. Absolutely. I learned that the hard way. You know, I’m curious if you were as a kid, were you like a questioner? Like, why why why?
Or were you a questioner type of kid?

Helen Gretchen Jones: So what was interesting is I would say, yes, I was very curious and I wanted to understand things. I’m also a first born, so I think that feeling in control, if psychology has anything to do with it, being in control and understanding what’s happening around you is important for the first born because they feel like they need to, you know, take care of the younger ones. So I guess that was a questioner, but for the most part, if someone would tell me something and this is true to this day and they talk with their hands, so that has to be both, I don’t know. And they’re talking with their hands and they’re it comes right here in front of their chest. Okay? If they’re saying something that is heartfelt and true, it’ll be like this kind of shimmer of light behind it, but only if it’s in front of their chest. If they’re saying something that is not quite true or they are exaggerating or they’re trying to convince the people who they’re talking to that it’s truth, when it’s not full truth, that kind of thing, or a flat out lie, I guess, could also be the case. But most people try to, you know, embellish the truth. You know, whenever that happens, there’s like this little shadow that comes up. And I only see it in front of the chest, and I only see it come from the hands. So sometimes when people would say something even in childhood and I would see that, I wouldn’t have to question. But in my mind, I’d be questioning why they felt the need to say that if it wasn’t true. So I wouldn’t ask them, why are you lying? Because I was watching to see how it would play out between the adults. But it was an interesting dynamic and under any truth and exciting it’s coming from my heart truth.

Victoria Volk: That’s fascinating. What do you feel like you need to share or want to share that you maybe haven’t gotten to yet?

Helen Gretchen Jones: I think, Beth Dula, I’m going to maybe if I could talk a little bit about that. It’s a relatively new position, and I think it has come up about with our changing healthcare system. Nurses have so much more responsibility in paperwork now that they have to adhere to, and they just can’t spend time with patients like they used to. And so there is a need for people in hospitals to have people sitting with them, those who are terminal. And that’s where a death doula kind of fits in. And when I’ve talked to people in the past, there are death doula who typically are very spiritual in some way. But I think that it’s important to note that The most important thing I believe about being a death doula is to meet people where they are. I have helped people of all religion, of all different faiths, of all different cultures, And I’ve even had them have their faith contradicted near death. And when someone’s dying, they take comfort in their faith, and it’s not the time to really play up those contradictions. No, it’s time to figure out how those contradictions, how can you make them okay? Because it’s all about finding someone peace. It’s all about peace being a death doula. At least that’s my belief. So if you’re a death doula or you’re interested in working with people who are dying there are organizations such as hospices. Also, there’s an organization called Noda, which I volunteer for. It stands for no one dies alone. It’s a hospital based program throughout the country. And it’s for people who have no family. Maybe they never had kids, maybe family lives out of the country, or out of the state, and can’t afford to come in. Maybe they were total jerks and burned all their bridges, and nobody wants to be there. It doesn’t matter. There are people everyday dying alone in hospitals. And they don’t have anyone to sit with them. So a note of volunteer, it’s a weekend training, that’s all it is, and a flu shot. And you and they send out this email blast to all their volunteers, and you sign up for three hour shifts. And these are people who have already entered the actively dying phase, which means the last seventy two hours or less. Most of the time, they’re already unconscious. You go in to sit with them. You are going in and you are doing what you believe is best for them in that moment unless they have a bio sheet and sometimes they do which tells you their faith. So if you’re working with someone who’s a devout Baptist, which happened to me, then I put on I played some hymns from my phone, you know, that I thought she would enjoy. And I put my hands on her and I did a little bit of energy work and things like that. I’m healing from my heart. I’m forming that connection. So there’s a need for people to be with those who are dying, especially since nurses aren’t able to do it like they used to be able to. So I would encourage anyone who feels like this might be something to absolutely pursue it. It’s very rewarding.

Victoria Volk: You know, that brings up something for me because I have, you know, nursing homes in my area and we have a hospital, but I’m very rural. There’s a high likelihood that my nearest hospital is not a participant of this and I mean, I’m I believe I’m probably the only train death to Dula in my entire county probably for ninety miles around me. Yeah. I’m gonna I’m gonna consider that.

Helen Gretchen Jones: It’s a quick phone call or email to let people know that you’re here and to help them understand how you’re valuable and you are. You know? And I think that anyone who’s working in those areas under stands that there are families who are already grieving before their loved one has transitioned, who are processing so much, am I doing the right thing? Am I putting my loved one in the nursing home? Am I, you know, are they getting their needs met?
There’s all these questions people have if they’re doing the right thing? Around their loved one. And if you’re there to consult with them and to help them understand, in most cases, nursing homes are understaffed and underpaid. And so it’s been my experience so far. That you do have to be still very, very present as a caregiver even when you have them in a nursing home. And it isn’t about doing right or wrong because it really doesn’t matter in that way. But understanding that just because you have them in a nursing home doesn’t mean you’re completely you can let go. You still need to check-in on them and make sure they’re being monitored in the best way possible and being an advocate for them.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. My dad had passed away in a nursing home. Yeah. I wasn’t there. Imagine, you know, it’s like most people, like your passions, become come from a place of your wounding. Right? Just like you’re what you’re doing now, the experience of losing your father, like, was this catapult and what you’re doing today? And so what do you what gives you hope for the future?

Helen Gretchen Jones: I don’t know. I think I’m eternally hopeful all the time.

Victoria Volk: That’s good. No. It’s actually a very different answer than I’ve ever received. So thank you.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Oh, I I just I guess I choose the story where I see so much love and hope on this on this entire planet, and I am so aware that I get to create and co create my experiences. With my team and that’s what I want. And so that’s what I make choices around. So like when we hang up here, I will be doing a meditation sometime before nine o’clock tonight and I will be attempting to connect to my team because when it does have a feel connected, I feel inflow with the world around me and that is hopeful and that is loving and that is connected. But I have to do the work. If I go days without meditating and it does happen, I start to really get into my human. I start to really focus on all these physical little challenges that can I can blow up to be bigger than what they really are? But when I do the work and I say, today’s, you know, I’m gonna I’m gonna take five minutes, ten minutes, twenty minutes, and do my meditation. That’s how it started. I mean, now my meditations are often over an hour, but because I want them to be.
I feel so good. But initially, it’s five minutes. I’m like, wow. Five minutes was nothing. And I just feel so much more connected to this world and to myself.
So, yeah, that’s I’m hopeful because I choose to be.

Victoria Volk: Like you said, we have to do the work.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Yeah. And it’s really not that hard of work to connect.

Victoria Volk: Was there anything else we would like to share?

Helen Gretchen Jones: Yeah. I feel like we covered a lot of information. I just I just want people to know that they’re not alone in their grief and that every single person goes through it and finding a way that is most helpful for you is beneficial not just to you but to the family and the people that you surround yourself with because they can feel your grief as well. And I encourage, like I mentioned earlier, if people are open to it, to consider even if it’s out of curiosity, a medium. Because so much screen, they could go through one thirty minute, forty five minute or hour session with the medium and come out of it feeling I mean, you process it for days, but you feel like you’re on CloudNine. And it’s it’s sort of like this beautiful high of being connected again to your loved one. And so I encourage if your grief is around the loss of a loved one and not the loss of, you know, a job or a, you know, a home or anything else like that if it really is a medium can help in that way.

Victoria Volk: And I would piggyback that to challenge your stories and beliefs that you have because they could be the very thing that’s handicap handicapping your healing.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Absolutely. And it is one of the hardest things that we can ever do, which is self reflect. And people who don’t self reflect always think they’re self reflecting. But one way to know if you’re genuinely self reflecting is if you come up with a defense. For your actions in some way. You know what? I behave this way because of this. If there’s a defense to your thoughts, then you’re not fully self reflecting. You’re still trying to make right your choice. And so I would suggest that. So if you’re truly being self reflective and trying to bring in that self awareness, you’re not trying to defend in any way your actions or your choices.

Victoria Volk: That’s juicy. I love that. That’s good. What was the website that you would recommend that people go to to find a qualified vetted medium?

Helen Gretchen Jones: Yes. Okay. So I know helping parents heal has one. Has a a list. And there are other lists out there. And I’m trying to remember the universities that do it. I feel like it might have been a university. I I see I don’t wanna give the wrong ones, but I feel like if I had to and I could be wrong, I think that there was one in Arizona, one in North Texas, and one in Virginia that have qualified, had done research studies on these vetted mediums, and have put out a list of these people. So I could be wrong on those. I feel like maybe though that those are correct, but you can even Google certified mediums, things like that, and there’s some really good ones out there. A lot, actually.

Victoria Volk: Okay. I will do some research or if you want us if you find know of a link that you have, send it to me and I’ll add it to the show notes. And then also where can people find you if they wanna connect with you, read your book, where can they find that, all of that good stuff?

Helen Gretchen Jones: So my website is helen gretchen jones dot com. And on there, you can find information about the book and the services that I offer. My book is sold on barnes and nobles dot com and, of course, on Amazon. And it’s both in it’s in three ways. It’s in paperback, Kendall, and an audiobook.
Red by yours truly.

Victoria Volk: Awesome. And where on social media are you? People listening.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Oh, I’m so bad with social media. Like, it is not my favorite thing. I am on Facebook under Helen Gretchen Jones, and I am also on Instagram under Helen Gretchen Jones. I did get banned from TikTok because I said death too many times and I you’re supposed to say unalive. But that’s really difficult.
I know. I know. I On a live

Victoria Volk: What is this world coming to? This is why we are so uncomfortable with death and dying. Right.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Exactly. Exactly.

Victoria Volk: Oh, you can’t say death now or dead or dying? Like,

Helen Gretchen Jones: And you can’t and I don’t it just seems so silly to me because death comes for the old as well as the young, the sick, and the healthy. I mean, it’s it comes for every single being and yet the longer that, you know, and whenever I think it started probably if I had to really do some research. I think it’s probably around the civil wartime when we started having to involve our soldiers in order to get them home. You know? And once that started happening, there became this new culture for us where we when someone dies, we have someone else collect the body, someone else cleanses the bot cleanses the body, someone else puts the body, you know, goes through the embalming process, someone else lowers the body into the ground like it’s so distant. You know? So we’ve we’ve created this for ourselves. And so now death is something to be feared. It’s the unknown. It’s distant from what we have to deal with. And we fear the unknown when that happens. And so we’ve created this culture of death as a taboo topic. And Certainly, I think with the book and with interviews, like the one I’m having with you now, one of the goals is to normalize talking about death and to also normalize talking about the spiritual experiences around death.

Victoria Volk: And how healing it can be when we open ourselves to a different possibility.

Helen Gretchen Jones: Don’t shut yourself off. That’s right. Allow yourself to be curious always and be open. You know, it’s the best.

Victoria Volk: Just got full body chills. That was the main message here today, folks. Thank you so much for being here, Helen, for sharing all that you shared. It’s I just I felt like this the whole time. I’m like, let’s like in a trans listening too. You have a beautiful voice too by the way. Do you have a podcast?

Helen Gretchen Jones: I don’t.

Victoria Volk: Oh, really?

Helen Gretchen Jones: I’m not in the flow of that yet. We’ll just have to see how it unfolds.

Victoria Volk: Oh, maybe maybe in the future. Six months to a year, ballpark. Because as many times you said ballpark, and then I was thinking about the dot the world series game, I’m gonna ballpark in my head for probably

Helen Gretchen Jones: That’s so funny. That’s true.

Victoria Volk: There’s a rabbit hole I’m supposed to go down apparently. So thank you so much for being here and and remember, when you unleash your heart, you unleash your life much loved.